It's THE PRIUS stupid....

You obviously think of car as transportation. The majority of the population think of a car as status symbol. The Prius fails miserably on that front. I'm fully converted now but if it wasn't for the PiP, there was no way I would "waste" my money on such an ugly duckling.

 

Sedans sell more in the US market than hatchbacks. They are simply more popular. So much so that car makers don't feel it is worth it to even offer the hatchback and wagon versions of sedans here. They do exist in other markets. The profitability of the SUV played its part, but now that consumers are starting to shift away from them, we get crossovers which bear little resemblance to the sedan chassis it's derived from. The Venza is beefier looking than the Camry. In years past they would have been sharing front end sheet metal.

They only midsize or larger hatchbacks or wagons available, that aren't luxury brands are the Prius, the v, the C-max, and the Accord Crosstour. It changes in the smaller segments, but they don't garner the sales of the midsize sedans.

As to taking on the Prius directly, what benefit is there to a manufacturer to do so? There are other niches to market a hybrid that won't be an uphill battle. That also won't end up with the new car being called a Prius clone. Like what happen with the Insight2, despite the gen2 and 3 Prius profile, and rear split window, being copied from the original Insight.

 

We didn't buy the Prius because of it's style... because frankly, it isn't stylish.
We didn't buy the Prius because it got the absolute best milage per gallon... although it does in so many categories.
We didn't buy the Prius just because the car in my avatar went tits-up in my driveway when I had to get to work... but the same week the Vette died, I did own a brand new Prius with 10 miles on the odo (4 of which I put on in the test drive).

We bought the Prius because it was available (read = no Volt was made yet), it wasn't red (I don't own a red car), it had the features I wanted in my next ride (back-up camera, bluetooth, navigator), it was made by Toyota (and every Toyota I have ever owned was a good ride), and I didn't want to spend $500 a month on gas anymore just commuting to work (which was what I was paying to drive the Vette to work).

What I saved in buying gas, made the car payments for this little car while it got me back and forth to Rancho Cordova to earn a living so I can pay the mortgages and insurances I have to as a productive and responsible adult... I didn't get any kick-backs or rebates or refunds or credits when we bought the Prius... but it has turned out to be everything I needed in a commuter, and as a ferry for my frau to the various professionals she has to see that has kept her here with me these last years since we got the car... I kinda want to think the car is one of the reasonsmy frau is still with me = because her doctors said she wasn't supposed to be alive the year I got this little car...

So... I kind of look at my little green buger as the good luck charm for my having the good fortune of still having another day with my frau... just last night on our way home from her doctor, Susan said she was happy we got the car when we did...

I am too.

 

A car with a base price of $24, 200 is asked to be a status symbol? really?

A car is transportation.

 

A Prius is transportation... sure.

Not all cars are merely transportation Bra...



Some have style and put a smile on your face when you're getting from one place to another... just saying.

 

Very astute observation. I view my car as economical transportation. I view my USGA handicap as my "status symbol". My personality has always been to place greater weight to a persons knowledge, skills or abilities, than to what they may own (car, house, or otherwise...).

When I raced, I was always drawn to the guy that had "junk" equipment and kicked everyone's butt on the track. Not the guy that had the best equipment, a $50K car hauler, and ran in the middle of the pack.

 

Oh they "get it". The issue is that they cannot "do it".

Look at what you are facing as a competing auto maker. You must accomplish all of the following:
1) You must have Prius like mpg numbers
2) You must have Toyota reputation reliability for decades
3) You must have a massive hybrid component manufacturing volume to acheive low component cost for a under $25k car.

You only get there by committing really big money over a really long period (like Toyota did). If you are just a few mpg short, or have a few battery/hybrid problems, or it cost a few $1000 more, you are going to take a bath....a really big nasty drubbing. So if you are a competitor, is it best to fight Toyota's strength head on or to find a different battleground?

We have our answer.

 

The problem is that Toyota started out by doing some very serious, very expensive, research into the basics of what makes a car, and what might make it better. They went through lot of different ways for making a machine move, and did endless testing of various vehicles.

Once they got something viable they started out with limited sales (Japan only), cleaned up early flaws, and spent the next thirteen years quietly improving and upgrading the car.

This completely clashes with anything that Detroit does. Detroit is willing to slap a battery in the glove box and a decal on the bumper, maybe bend a little sheet metal, but doesn't really want to do all that hard work. Without the work they're going to have trouble getting competitive results.

 

Toyota hit a huge home run with Prius (best/most important car ever?) even if it wasn't a Hybrid it would still sell well due to practicality, but oh by the way, it gets 50 MPG. Toyota seems to be 5-10 MPG better than the competition due to design and computer control features. Coming from station wagons and minivans, it is the snazziest car I ever owned. A real babe magnet too, OK , not really I have not been approached yet by any.

 

In general, the Prius hides the HV battery well. The Prius c seems exceptional at this. Other venders seem to dump a battery in the trunk with no regard to using that trunk. Then they can't sell their car and wonder why.

If you wish to sell hybrids, it has to work as a car not just work as a hybrid. (if you read about folks unhappy with the second Honda Insight, it did not work as a people mover)

 

The thing that so many detractors overlook is that the Prius was the first production hybrid to be designed from the ground up, and not just kludged onto an existing frame. Form and function flowing from each other, not disparate elements duct taped together. It's why it's meaningless to compare the cost of a purpose-designed hybrid to any other type of vehicle. Apples and oranges.

 

"Free" Copies of The Prius That Shook The World--m | Page 3 | PriusChat

If you are serious about the amount of work that went into the Prius and how it came about, the above link still works.

 

I'm living proof. A year ago, I was a most unlikely Prius owner. Never liked the looks of the Prius, but was always envious of the great fuel mileage. Not the first time for that. I was also, envious of the Geo Metro's mileage back in the early nineties. I was out looking at new cars back in January of this year. I considered everything. I came home thinking Prius. At this point in my life, I didn't need a fast, sporty, expensive car. Had a few of those in the past. I thought the Prius would be fun and a welcomed change. Not that pretty, definitely not fast. Doesn't have to prove anything, other than get great fuel mileage. What's wrong with that? I have a short 20 mile daily commute. Work and home are time consuming. I don't put a lot of miles on a car. I could afford to feed a Hummer or any other gas guzzler. Only one other Toyota in my life, a 1997 Toyota Tacoma pickup which I recently sold. Nobody has more hybrid experience than Toyota. I didn't have a second choice. I'm very happy with my Prius Plug In after six months. A nice set of wheels, and a few mods, it looks pretty good. My plans are to give up my leased 2011 Lexus IS in December. I'll be a full time Prius owner and driver. A welcomed commitment.

 

Thanks FL I was able to download the pdf from this post:

i probably shouldn't post this but after doing a google search, i found a pdf file of it online. i wonder how long before the toyota people here tell the rest of the toyota people...

The Prius That Shook The World​

Read more: http://priuschat.com/threads/free-copies-of-the-prius-that-shook-the-world-m.9258/page-3#ixzz2bFCipOJ1
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I disagree, somewhat. As a counter-example, let's look at full-size pickup trucks, which Detroit has been building and improving for decades and Japan has yet to really figure out. Toyota first tried with the T-100, which was a 7/8ths scale model of a pickup truck. The Tundra was much better and looks really good on paper, but has serious rust issues (Toyota Tundra - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) and tends to be a bit wobbly over bumps:

(think washboard dirt road). At least Toyota is in the game. The Nissan Titan was a wide miss and the Honda Ridgeline is some weird El Camino wannabe made out of a minivan.

 

I came from a big car family. nearly 100% GM my prius (as short lived as it was ) was my first Asian car. After getting mid 20's mpg in a chevy HHR I was shopping fuel economy and functionality on a budget. (sub 20K) so I ended up a lightly used 2010 prius iv

the prius was able to serve my needs, its instantly recognizable as what it is.... but had some functionality struggles. Which is the reason I jumped ship to ford when the tree fell on the prius...

Is the prius a svelte swoopy head turning car...not really, but neither is the ford. I don't think its the reason folks buy the car though.

For me a car has become an appliance...Maybe at some point in time in the future I'll buy a car as a car guy...

Toyota nailed the true hybrid concept and it was a good enough car to go mainstream...

I doubt any other car maker will ever copy the prius (honda tried and failed). If anything they want to distance themselves from the prius (especially the looks) and show that a hybrid can be a normal car, good looking, functional, and get better fuel mileage than its ICE only counterpart. Now if they can get the hybrid prices to be comparable to the ICE then we are getting somewhere.

 

http://www.daihatsu.com/catalogue/granmax/download/pickup.pdf
but not in the USA

Toyota badge engineers it as the LiteAce
Toyota LiteAce - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

http://www.honda.co.jp/ACTY/truck/