Finally Did It ...

Discussion in 'Gen 1 Prius Plug-in 2012-2015' started by PiPLosAngeles, Aug 16, 2013.

  1. usbseawolf2000

    usbseawolf2000 HSD PhD

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    Yup. Why should one power source bare the burden of lugging the other around?

    For a vehicle with both power sources, synergy is crucial. Both having on board should result better than each doing it alone.

    I think PiP proved it by beating both the regular Prius and Leaf, without giving up cargo or seating capabilities.
     
  2. iplug

    iplug Senior Member

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    On- or off-grid, as long as the clean electricity source doesn't directly or indirectly cause the offset of others using dirtier electricity sources, it's fair accounting to give the person generating the clean energy the credit. In the United States, the offset issue doesn't seem to be a big deal right now as renewables and natural gas are increasing and coal is decreasing to match. Certainly we can't all have solar and wind until we come up with a better solution for clean base-load power.
     
  3. giora

    giora Senior Member

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    I generally agree with your post.
    I do think offset issue should be a big deal, variations among states are still substantial.
     
  4. PiPLosAngeles

    PiPLosAngeles Senior Member

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    It doesn't work like that, though. My utility has specific regular suppliers and when they need more electricity it is purchased from other specific suppliers, not some "national average". My increased consumption of clean electricity doesn't create a hole that has to be filled by "dirty" electricity.
     
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  5. Lourun

    Lourun Member

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    I think your dreaming, or at lest wishful thinking! Because yes it is all inter connected.
     
  6. PiPLosAngeles

    PiPLosAngeles Senior Member

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    Interconnected does not mean that new demand is satisfied with dirty electricity, even if tangentially.
     
  7. Lourun

    Lourun Member

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    Power flows to the load, you can't only except your clean electricity, it flows from source to need, depending on how the power authority controls the flow.
     
  8. usbseawolf2000

    usbseawolf2000 HSD PhD

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    You demand clean electricity but consume dirtier electricity. The end result? The entire grid average gets cleaner, slightly.
     
  9. PiPLosAngeles

    PiPLosAngeles Senior Member

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    When my demand increases by 1MWh per year to charge my PiP, my local utility has to ramp up production by that amount, or purchase it on the spot market if they don't have the capacity. They are in control of which plants supply that excess capacity. In my case those plants are solely wind and solar. I am not robbing some part of the grid of power that requires replacement with dirty coal. My demand is new demand being satisfied with new generation capacity.

    Even if 100% of my power came from the dirtiest form of coal, the CO2 emissions for a 3kWh charge would be about 6.5 lbs. That's the equivalent of 1/3-gallon of gasoline. As long as I can drive 16 miles or further on a single charge, charging with 100% coal power is still a net decrease in CO2 emissions. According to the EIA only 38% of the power generated in 2013 so far has been from coal, so we're ahead of the game on average.
     
  10. Lourun

    Lourun Member

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    I'm glad you live in a clean power area, unfortunately here in the north east, except for nuclear, I do not.
     
  11. PiPLosAngeles

    PiPLosAngeles Senior Member

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    According to this article, PSE&G generated 85% of its electricity from nuclear and natural gas in 2011.
     
  12. Lourun

    Lourun Member

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    You right but I don't consider natural gas green. It's cleaner than coal, but.
     
  13. PiPLosAngeles

    PiPLosAngeles Senior Member

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    You can generate 16 kWh with natural gas for the same amount of CO2 as burning one gallon of gasoline. If you get 10 miles per charge with electricity generated from natural gas you're breaking even on CO2 emissions (and doing much better on a dozen other pollutants).
     
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