Considering a PiP - some questions

that's not true - if you've been on these threads for a bit you'll see 0% down, 0% loans - 5 yrs
I didn't pay a cent til that first payment in April

Before this PiP I had a '99 Avalon - ended up costing $1k a year, no repairs other than a muffler.
Also in our family was a '92 Suburu - better yet - went 17 yrs and once again no repairs other than the muffler.
That one cost 12k new so well under 1k a year. No lease would've come close to that, I have a figure in mind but someone else can figure what it saved...
I'm confident there won't be any trade in on my PiP, I'll drive it til it won't go anymore in 15 yrs

For some driving a new car every 3 years is a lifestyle choice. A real estate friend does just that and I get it - he's driving clients around wants to project a certain level...

 

I think your luck with your long term ownership is very unusual, I have many friends with older cars that don't have such luck, there for I chose to have a new car every 3 years. I guess I just can afford it, while others can't.

 

I recently read the average age of a vehicle in the us was now a record 11 yrs. They don't break down like they used to.
I just bought good makes and kept up on the maintenance, I know many don't...

As for affording it, I could - I mean I'm 55 and retired except for coaching year round at the local high school.
I just choose to invest and spend elsewhere. My father said he chose not to drive his wealth down the road, guess that made sense to me. I'll add that I took a certain pleasure in driving a pretty beat 17 yr old Suburu wagon in a very nice town

 

It's not that putting money down is required - I did not say that. I said that you often must do so to avoid being upside-down on the loan for years, which is true.

Far be it from me to argue that a new car is cheaper than an old - that was never my argument and I stated so explicitly earlier. That's not what we were discussing. The discussion hinged on whether leasing is a reasonable alternative to purchasing new. I maintain that it is, so long as one has done their homework looking at all options.

My PIP replaced a 17 year old Volvo that I maintained flawlessly and was supremely reliable for us. I track every repair on my vehicles, and know how much it costs to own them. With the gas savings, the PIP is still slightly more expensive to own than the old Volvo, but I'm ok with that. We have had Subarus over the years, and I help many friends maintain theirs. Either you aren't telling the whole story there - (tires, brakes, oil changes, suspension and steering components, etc) and/or you are a whole lot more tolerant of driving a worn out vehicle than I am. I still have old vehicles, but they have to be maintained and in great condition for me to bother with them.

 

There was no "often" in your original statement. Reads a lot different with it :

When you purchase and finance for say, 5 years, you must put a large down payment to prevent you from being dangerously upside-down on the loan for years. That's money that you can't be using for other things.

My PIP replaced a 17 year old Volvo that I maintained flawlessly and was supremely reliable for us. I track every repair on my vehicles, and know how much it costs to own them. With the gas savings, the PIP is still slightly more expensive to own than the old Volvo, but I'm ok with that. We have had Subarus over the years, and I help many friends maintain theirs. Either you aren't telling the whole story there - (tires, brakes, oil changes, suspension and steering components, etc) and/or you are a whole lot more tolerant of driving a worn out vehicle than I am. I still have old vehicles, but they have to be maintained and in great condition for me to bother with them.
[/quote]

I said repairs - that doesn't include tires or oil changes - 17 yrs without an oil change would be pushing it !
No suspension or steering components but I was mistaken and left out that we needed brakes over that time - probably twice. That '92 Suburu went 170,000 miles.

 

Zhenya, I have a question from one of your early posts in this thread. You said that Toyota sets depreciation, and that it is non-negotiable. But then later you said that as part of your deal, you were able to negotiate the price at which you will be able to buy the car at the end of the lease. My experience (GM leases) is that the buyout price is established by the lessor at the start of the lease, and you pay the difference between that price and whatever you negotiate to be the "selling price" of the vehicle, spread over the term of the lease. Then at the end of the lease, as was mentioned in another post, you may be able to get them to lower that buyout price. But I don't believe if Toyota is indeed setting depreciation that they will negotiate that figure at lease inception. Can you please clarify? Thanks.
Something that I didn't see mentioned in the discussion regarding leasing is that when you return the vehicle, it has to be in very good condition or they may nickel and dime you for dings, scratches, tire wear, etc. Add to those costs the "disposal fee" or whatever they choose to call it, and you may have a substantial surprise bill.

 

Hey Roger,

It sounds like we are on the same page. If it read like I was able to negotiate the buyout price up-front, I did not intend that. I agree that you can negotiate the sale price up-front, and then the buy-out price at lease end. Your payment is the combination of the depreciation fee, the finance fee (money factor) and tax. The dealer can monkey with the purchase price and money factor, but not the depreciation.

Yes, you are right that some people may not be good for leasing depending on how they care for the vehicle. I know that I personally take very good care of my vehicles, and given extensive reporting of experiences on other forums, it does not sound like most dealers are as hard as people might expect. It's a used car at that point; they don't expect it to be perfect!

 

I guess it depends on who is doing the inspecting. Maybe the banks contract with someone to examine lease returns? I've heard that some of them can be pretty nit-picky.

 

fyi - Boston area. I'm set, not looking to add a 2nd PiP but this thread got me curious. This was the first email, seems as though if I asked for a bit more off they'd comply but no proof of that and seems disingenuous to pursue...
This confirms the 25.5k pricing (net of $2500 back) no mention of the 0% 60 mo financing so have to assume not :




Dear Brian,
Thank you for your interest the 2013 Toyota Prius Plug In. How do you like your Prius Plugin?

Below I have prepared a quote for you, as well as included a link for you to view our 2013 Prius Plug In Inventory with LIVE-Online Pricing!
Also, with all new Toyota's you will get ToyotaCare which is a 2 year/25,000 mile complimentary maintenance program that cover's your oil changes, tire rotations, and roadside assistance on your new Prius.

2013 Toyota Prius Plug InElectronic Continuous Variable Transmission
MSRP: $33,104
Internet Price: $28,179

 

The only way an extended warranty would make sense is if it took effect upon the expiration of the manufacturers warranty. The one the dealership tried to sell me would have taken effect the day I bought the car. $2,572 for something the manufacturer already covers for three to five years? No thanks.

 

Hi There,
I was considering leasing a regular Prius liftback until i saw this offer on PiP. Went to a dealer nearby, test drove & really liked the car. The base PiP comes pretty well equipped too. Was however surprised when the numbers I was quoted were nowhere near this offer. It was more like 280-290 / month with 1 k down. I have always bought a car until now so wasn't sure what would a fair price to pay on a lease. I am assuming i will not get the exact advertised offer but wanted to get a sense of range others may have paid on this deal. Any input would be greatly appreciated !

 

It probably depends on where you live, as the incentives vary from state to state. Bottom line is that whatever is advertised, you should get that deal or better if you are a good negotiator. Some people on this forum went out of state to get a better deal, and either had the car shipped or drove it home.

 

Thanks. So basically i have lot of room to negotiate. That's good to know. I live in NJ & i think this deal is available in the tri state area ...

 

I'm from northern NJ leased my pip this past June, if that monthly payment is with tax included your get a better deal than I did. Although I didn't put anything down, to reduce the monthly payments.

 

The exact details of the lease do depend on your market, but if they are advertising the $179/month $1999 down and those numbers you quote are inclusive of all taxes and fees, they are close, but taking a fair bit of profit for themselves. The advertised deal always leaves money in it for the dealer. It sounds like they are padding it a bit above that still.

A few things about leasing in general; 1) never put any money down beyond first month's payment and tags. 2) don't let them sell you on monthly payments. Learn how a lease is calculated and work only with those numbers. If they won't give you the residual and money factor values, find a dealer who will. 3) negotiate the sale price of the vehicle just like a purchase.

If you would like some more specific detail, feel free to ask or take it to PM.

 

I challenge you to lease a 2013 pip for only 179 with 1999 a month down for 36 months.

 

Uh, I've already done just that, but put zero down, and knocked the selling price down a fair bit as well, beating that deal by a fair margin.

 

I find that very hard to believe!

 

Sorry! I can assure you I am being straightforward. The 179/1999 deal is still advertised here. Not sure why you think it wouldn't be offered to actual customers!

 

Sorry I stand corrected I saw the offer on Toyota web site, sure is a better deal than I got only 3 months later!