There has been a quite few threads in PC discussing effects of EtOH in gas. Just do search with "Ethanol" https://priuschat.com/search/79621350/?q=ethanol&o=relevance Most of perceived effects (mostly bad) are related to water entering into the system. If you can find and get 100% gas in your area at reasonable price, it won't hurt. Cost vs Performance comparison would largely depend on the availability. For our area, 100% gas dose not exist in regular gas station. In very rare occasion, when I find 100% gas for marine or other special use, they are sooooo expensive, that any benefits of using it would be cost prohibitive.
Yes it's been discussed to death. The only real advantage is slightly better gas mileage.......but if you do the math, the price difference isn't worth it........especially if the only E0 you can get is "premium", where the price difference might be 50 cents a gallon or more.
Depends on the price of E10 Ethanol blend. Here, it's 1% cheaper than regular unleaded - but E10 uses more fuel than 1% - more like 2-3% from my experience.
Agree with you. But, so many "ethanol in gasoline" advocates lie on such forums as this, that 100% ethanol-free gasoline still is mis-understood. The biggest "ethanol in gasoline" lie is that 10% ethanol blend (E10) only has a 3% MPG loss, due to its lower energy, which IS true, But, more losses occur since ethanol has an octane rating of 114. When used (not burned properly) in an 87 octane engine, ethanol can NOT release its energy effectively. Adding only 10% ethanol to gasoline, actually loses 8% to 5% MPG. Another source of loss in E10: One part 114 octane ethanol MUST be blended to nine parts 84 octane real gasoline to come up with a miserable, but designated 87 octane concoction blend, that has very little actual 87 octane fuel, that is used in an 87 octane engine. It is a wonder, that my last five 87 octane engines only lost 8%, 8%, 7%-8%, 7% & 5% MPG comparing E10 to E0. pure-gas.org now lists 13,400+ sources for E0. Most E0 is in higher octanes, so you'll have to scour to find 87 octane E0 sources. As stated by others, the "ethanol in gasoline industry" & EPA work hard to keep E0 priced well above E10.
In the old days, Prius owners used to try to set records like miles per tank up to 800 miles. In this case, you would want to fill up with E0 to maximize MPG and cruising range. Otherwise as stated above, in the USA the price of E0 is usually so high that the MPG advantage is not enough to make up the price difference. Many Prius owners like me are in USA reformulated gasoline regions and cannot get E0 at all, so it is a theoretical point only.
That depends on just whose tests you look at. One big batch of tests I looked at many years ago really did come in at 3-something-% loss, very close to the expectation based on energy content. And tests of a higher ethanol content (don't remember if it was E15 or E20) also came in very close to expectations.
WOW. I can't think of a better example of LIES about something. Do you work for an oil company.......or have you just been brainwashed by someone who buys into their lies ???
87 Octane E0 gas takes more high Octane components than 87 Octane E10 gas, as Ethanol has a higher Octane inherently, allowing a lower octane petroleum stock. No one has to 'make' it cheaper, E10 is made both of cheaper petroleum components and fewer of them.
True but it is easy for a refinery to make a little more octane...that's what refineries do, given the octane of the raw gasoline in the crude oil is probably something like 40 octane. Let's face it, if it made sense for refiners to use ethanol, they would use it without being forced to do so by gov't mandates. Litesong does not sound like a oil supporter, he sounds like he is anti-ethanol. He is not the only person who feels that way, but the key point is ethanol does work as a gaso additive without too much problem. Similarly biodiesel works. Many gov'ts and many in the public feel the farming industry deserves to be allocated part of the fuel market, and that is where we are.
Sure. If the quantities were really small. But losing 10% of their market is a significant hit.......that they will NEVER admit is a good thing.......unless they can make more profit on it than they lost on the refined petrol.
Yes. Statistically: As mentioned above, up to a 3-percent gain in fuel efficiency.....IF the seller really sells E0, and IF they maintain their tanks and pumps to the same standards as the bigs. Real World: Only if you count the increased fuel efficiency of having a lighter wallet. I actually did not notice much of a difference even though I burned through two tanks back to back about 7 years ago. The closest gas station to me right now sells "real" gas, and every Saturday morning, middle aged motorcycle riders and boat owners of all ages line up and pony up so that they can put gas in their babies without any of that funny akly-haul stuff. Sometimes, when I used to work on Saturdays, I used to go over for a cup of coffee and watch people pay 35 cents more a gallon to fill up their boats and then add SeaFoam to the tank..... Entertainment is where you find it. Here's the deal with Priuses. Somebody much smarter than me once said in this forum that the main benefit to driving a Prius is that you can just....drive it like an ordinary car, and you will get extraordinary mileage. If I woke up in your shoes? I'd do that. Oh......and check to make sure that your oil level is good about every 2-3 tanks, and ask somebody smarter than me if they fixed the EGR issue with the G4.....but only if you plan to keep it out past the 120,000 mile point. Other than that? Just enjoy the ride! Good Luck!
I just topped off my tank with this. (Pressed the wrong button. ) I hope it doesn't fry my pistons! Shell V-Power NiTRO+ Premium Gasoline FAQs | Shell United States Shell › us Shell V-Power NiTRO+ Premium Gasoline is an innovative premium formulation engineered with triple-action protection for optimal engine performance. It delivers unsurpassed protection against gunk, unbeatable protection against corrosion, and our best protection against wear.
This isn't actually a claim of being better than everyone or anyone else. It only means to claim they are equal to the best. But if all the majors are equal to each other ...
I had a longer test, a touring holiday of 2100km, in my KIA RIO, CVVT engine which would adjust to octane variations - I did 3 or 4 tanks of each grade then swapped to a different one. Consistently, when I went to E10, fuel use increased by about 2½-3% - for a 1% saving in $$$ cost. I also tried high octane (here 95 or 98) - and they both gave measurable improvement over our Standard fuel (91 here), but on a $$$ basis, it didn't measure up - the l/100km savings were less than the increased $$$ tank cost. BIODIESEL - isn't good. When I bought my first Diesel (FORD FOCUS), I immediately filled it up round the corner from home, as I was doing a 600km journey the next day. Next morning, I stopped to pick my son-in-law up for the trip. The engine didn't start. Tried again - started. Not impressed with that happening with a new car. We stopped for Coffee. Again, didn't start - did the 2nd time. 7 times I stopped, it did the same, whether it had stopped for 2 mins or ½ hr. When I got home, I went to the FORD service, and explained what was happening. Reception called the Workshop Manager - his first question - "Did you fill up at Freedom Fuels?". "Yes, it's round the corner from home." He responded "Avoid them in future - it's 10% BIODIESEL, and FORD specifically says not to use it (manual says up to 5% MAX) - to use xyz, xzz or yzz brands which don't use BIODIESEL at all. I topped my ¼ full tank with PROPER Diesel, and never had a repeat of the problem after the first re-start.
But nobody in the supply chain is losing 10%. Upstream of the point where ethanol is added, they are losing only 7% of the dinosaur-derived portion that gets turned into gasoline, but nothing on the larger portion turned into diesel, kerosene, and other refined petro products. But this is partially offset by the 3% increase in blended gasoline volume downstream of that ethanol addition point, plus some tax subsidies.
Right answer......wrong question. The subject was the "refiners" and they certainly DO lose 10% of their market.
How so? Please give more detail. That 3% loss of MPG has to be made up with extra volume delivered, because few or no people are adjusting to that lower MPG by driving fewer miles. So 90% of the extra is more dino-fuel, not ethanol. So for a given driving distance, one needs 0.90 / 0.97 ~= 93% of the dino-fuel compared to using E0. Then, refiners are making a lot more than just gasoline, and the majority of a barrel of crude goes to that other stuff. They are not losing anything on that other stuff from the ethanol addition to just the gasoline. Then, many of the refiners own more of the supply chain that just the refinery itself. So they benefit from the 3% extra volume of E10 that they transport and sell compared to what would be sold if just E0 was supplied.
