Prius Plug In P1A00, P1A61, P1A64, P1A67, P301A, P314A, P31AB

Amazing not much info on the Plug In Lithium packs. I finally ran, and tried to run away from and, across one.

Throws the Prius Plug In P1A00, P1A61, P1A64, P1A67, P301A, P314A, P31AB and typical three ABS ECU codes I'm used to seeing with the other gens when the HV pack is having issues.

Appears the recall for the fuse was never performed to begin with. Not sure if related or not as I've not found a reference for what codes get triggered in the event fuse goes bad. Still reading into NHTSA info.

P314A is hopefully straight forward regarding a connection or the inverter pump needing swapped. Will see when get to if not more as per the Service Manual of which I've not read into in detail yet. Still researching online sources prior.

However, the rest of the codes found appear to be resolved per replacing the HV pack with a known good one per:

1. The titled "Hybrid Cell Voltage" thread. Hybrid Cell Voltage | PriusChat
2. The Youtube video comments by Best Car Fixes titled "Toyota Prius 2012 No Starting Diagnose Codes P1A64-P1A67 P31AB-P1A61 _ Step By step part 1"

Per the not exact same code Hybrid App video titled "Prius Plug-In battery error code P1A05, P1A0A, P1A63, P1A64, P1A67", appears there are issues with the BSU. Purchase a used or new "battery smart unit" AKA: BSU and "the glass unit" from trusted source, parts number 89892-47011

I am wondering if the 2016-2022 Gen 4 Lithium option pack that uses the same looking case as the NiMH hv pack case uses the same BSU since looks the same per this Weber Auto video titled "2016 - 2022 Toyota Prius Li-Ion Battery" at this time 31:48.

I am also wondering as well about cells interchange between 2012-2015, 2016-2022 gen 4 Li-Ion and 2016-2022 Prime HV packs. Anyone familiar with and know about options regarding?

Removing the 2012-2015 Plug In pack can be found here at the Youtube video by Fully Charged Zone titled "Prius Plug-In Hybrid Battery Removal 2012-2015"

Two other videos I found on Youtube for the 2012-2015 Plug In are regarding cleaning the fans:
1. Toyota Maintenance titled "2015 Toyota Prius Plug-in Important Maintenance"
2. Marshall Goldberg titled "Prius Plug in Cooling Fan Clean"

 

Hi @Jjacktheripper,

Thank you kindly, definitely helps for certain.

Confirmed the BSU's are close looking from a distance, so I am only just a little crazy and hopeful overly optimistic. 2012-2015 Plug In Prius followed by Gen 4 Li-Ion HV pack option shown below for the curious.


I saw two sellers on eBay noting "2012-2022 Toyota Prius Plug-In HV Hybrid Battery Cell Lithium 3.5V OEM" with photos of what looked like 2012-2015 Pip cells and that alone boosted my confidence of dreams of interchange. Especially seeing more cost effective Prime packs online, so ideally newer cells.

Reminds me I can use a full version or two on my other dedicated Dr. Prius smartphones. Next pension payment.

 

Another one of a kind, kindly presented Hybrid App video by Sir Jack titled "Prius plug-in error code saga - Check engine light after bigger battery replacement - P1A05, P1A0A"

Nice, 2012 - 2015 Plug-In Prius brand new battery pack two years and unlimited miles warranty lithium battery upgrade doubling capacity. 2012 - 2015 Toyota Prius plug-in Lithium battery pack– NexPower Energy

 

Hi again Jack, what are the physical dimensions of the 2012-2015 PIP cell and the 2016-2022 Prime cell?

 

Latest observations of friends 2014: Codes P1A64, P1A67, P1A61, P31AB "Check Hybrid System" | Page 2 | PriusChat

Appears after charging for about 3hrs with the Nissan Leaf charger and going back in with the Autel MaxiAP200, that clearing the 10 Hybrid System and 1 ABS/VSC codes cleared all the codes so the dash if trouble light free.

Now wondering if all related to the 12V battery and maybe for the Hybrid System, the HV battery sitting for so long.

 

Well, she got roadside and lined up another pack or two with hopes one is still in good enough condition and me hoping I don't have to learn how to rebuild the packs. They don't look fun to disassemble. Reassembly doesn't seem enjoyable either, albeit foolish seeming. Mainly, I hope she gets a balanced pack with all the cells having similar voltage differences with similar enough charge and discharge rates. Wishful thinking.

However, I am very much inclined to see if feasible to hack the newer 2017-2022 and 2023-2026 PRIME cells somehow into a pack that fits safely using all the other 2012-2015 better parts. I don't comprehend yet why, other than safe fitment. Yeah, I'm being wishful, though I do enjoy learning something new and potential hacks.

From what I read, the 2010 Prototype PiP using 96 cells report a cell size as: 4.42 x 4.35 x 0.56 in.
The 2012 PiP using 56 cells report a cell size as: 4.13 x 5.83 x 1.04 in.
This is per https://techinfo.toyota.com/techInfoPortal/staticcontent/en/techinfo/html/prelogin/docs/priusphvdisman.pdf

Going by Weber Auto YT Weber State University bank specs appear to have 19 cells at 6 x 4 x 23 in, therefore I can safely assume the max cell size is definitely no more than 6 x 4 x 1.23 in. Bummer no detailed dimensions from there, though will update as I find. https://youtu.be/yGMcQ6JWlBs?t=1596 Appears sounds like the 1st and 2nd Gen PRIME cells are the exact same size dimensions, though 72 total in the pack with three stacks of 24 cell banks for the 2nd Gen PRIME.

The 2nd Gen PRIME is noted here as having 148mm (5.83in) x 91mm (3.58in) x 26.5mm (1.04in).

This leads me to believe the PRIME cells may be interchangeable in a PiP bank stack as no seller will reply with dimensions, i.e. Jack and eBay sellers. Depth being 1.04in and width being 5.83in equivalent and the height being the only difference where the newer PRIME are shorter I guess for better heating and cooling control fitment? Not sure just yet. Guessing from what I see as well is that the PRIME cells are being sold to fit the PiP and not the other way around, based on listing observations of PRIME pack sources and images in the listings even though claiming 2012-2022 cells.

Anyhow, enough background and research regarding potential capabilities. Next, on to the as-found latest situation.

OK, this time I read the codes using the Dr. Prius app and found some interesting info regarding the situation. I'll attach the screenshot here as well down below and I do agree lines up with what I remember the Autel app showing and similar codes although no engine codes were read when I used the Autel app last as-left. Maybe in the morning I'll try reading again with the Autel reader to see what is there. I don't comprehend why Dr. Prius is showing me more codes than the Autel and Techstream readings? Maybe something changed? I didn't read Engine ECU codes with Techstream however, so can't confirm that situation as-left.

What I find as strange is the Battery Monitor showing 0.77-0.74 (0.76 in the screenshot), though the block 5 vs block 7 calculates to 27.52 - 26.05 = 1.47. Definitely over the >1.2V or whatever lesser like >0.3V reported throws codes in the NiMH packs. Bank A, B, C and D I assume are blocks 1 & 2 per Dr. Prius being bank A per Techstream and so on and so forth. Bank C and Bank D along blocks do seem to be over that >0.3 limit. Wondering if Block 7 in Bank D has a smoker and that is what we were smelling or possibly reading some more the fan can cause a similar odor? Delta SOC definitely looks like in the red at 10.00% and there it is.

Maybe the 12V battery being low reading now, I don't recall what was prior as-found as-left, is causing the additional codes. Seems potentially likely I guess.

 

I made a video to begin documenting the High Voltage (HV) Battery Sense ECU for the 2012–2015 Toyota Prius Plug-in (ZVW35), a.k.a. the "glass unit," officially called the Battery Voltage Sensor or "Battery Smart Unit".

Would be nice to get this out to the electronic groups to get their thoughts regarding repair or even to begin with troubleshooting the easiest, as I am guessing many others will see parts or circuit sections that are more likely the cause of failure.

2012-2015 Plug In Prius PiP (Gen 3 Lithium Plug In Hybrid) Hybrid Errors: - YouTube

 

Any and all info on these PIP's is excellent IMO.

She was offered the charge controller and declined. Not sure if the pigtail was there with and I don't recall seeing attached to the cases. I'll see if I they still have the part and can ship. Since I have the contact info, I am thinking I might get and pay for shipping so I have in my parts stash for a PIP or maybe useful for some other custom project.

The boys and I all noticed a burning electrical like smell that we narrowed down to what seemed like the Brick C & D area. I didn't pull the trunk plastic insert out, though was wondering about the wire bundle going around the outside and the 12V positive connection. Wondering now if might have been coming from below and will visually inspect more thoroughly.

The smell came back the two times she wanted me to clear the codes and see if she could still drive.

Time for thermal camera time anyway, as I was planning on clearing the codes and attempting to recreate to see if I can pinpoint the source.

Next up is determining the better way to discharge the Brick A & B so to be closer to the value of the what appears better from old DrPrius data and test measurements Brick C & D replacements.

 

@ericbecky Are you able to confirm the PIP cells are as I found reported cell size as: 4.13 x 5.83 x 1.04 in. Mainly the 4.13" height. Appears is from what I can tell, though I've not compressed and drill out rivets on a Brick just yet. Will plan on doing in time.

Have you had or know anyone who has replace Brick cells with Prime newer shorter height ones? I still need to confirm the terminal spacing as well.

Wondering about making some sort of insert to space and not obstruct air flow since doubt will try to hack a heater and cooler to fit beneath. Would be interesting making something to space that would exchange heat as well.

 

Taking a break and finding I don't have the FTNIRS HRM-10 with, so need to go get. The second pack that came with has no bus bars connected, so plan to measure all 112 cells or at least 56 unless I find the reported 3 bad bricks quicker. I have a Reaktor charger with if I wanted to test capacity, though need to think about some more since is only a 10A charger.

Thinking is time to resurrect the Solar carbon pile tester refurb project, read into those more and design how to modify for smaller high capacity batteries. Seems like might be a useful discharge tool as well, if I am thinking clearly. Higher voltage, so less current so not certain how would damage just yet?

Interesting thinking about last night is that with the extra packs, I think I can get one from her to test designs, I think seems feasible to test making a plug in gen 2 or gen 3 like how others have using let say like the Enginer Plug-in Conversion Kit design literally can be replicated using the PiP pack and charger, if the ECU controls aren't to bad to figure out. Even if more complicated using all the PiP parts, can replicate the Enginer kit more easily being all the EV conversion info on charging packs using a range of hv battery chargers starting to show up at the self serve yards and are on the market for off the grid systems.

Reference (txt):

 

Just prior state of affairs: https://youtube.com/shorts/WtjfeED27co

 

Before I started disassembling, I wanted to thermal image scan for what might be the burning smell source noticed prior. Guessing due to preventative situation, that hopefully didn't fry anything, we were not able to recreate as she did when I went to trouble shoot on the side of the road after her first drive.

However, the Delta SOC shot up to 74% from the little over 10% as-found on the side of the road a few days back and that seems to correlate visually to the same Brick C block 6. Wondering if this is why (see attached images below)?

Also, wondering if this is why the prior owner gave up on since the nut appears stripped and I still need to work out a game plan to safely remove. Also, wishing I would have opened up and checked torque on all these nuts before listening to her to keep clearing battery codes when I found her on the side of the road. Maybe wasn't as bad prior upon initial Toyota ECU faulting to prevent startup. Then again, being nut was already in that state, guessing only stressed out cell and therefore balance more?

In regards to original and replacement Bricks getting close to balance charges for the Bricks and Blocks, will be interesting trying to discharge Brick A and B down to the replacement Brick C and D values being so charged. Definitely will be a first for me and thinking can do using five halogen headlights in series and possibly three for a Block if a Block seems too far different which will have to see once get to that step. Those halogens I'm planning to be using with a XY-CD63L DC 6-60V 30A Battery Charge Discharge Controller Switch Undervoltage Overvoltage Protection Voltage Percentage Display 0-999S Delay module. Any thoughts or suggestions?

Was also thinking about Regenerative or maybe using the Reaktor with the Halogens bulbs to External Discharge. Need to read into the later more since never heard before until reading in an RC group. Definitely will be more time consuming being the 24V 6S Lithium cells limit from what I understand so far.



Update: This mornings sunlight shined more openly on the problem and I wound up cutting a side off in hopes to open up the nut and remove, which did. Using a vacuum focused on the trajectory of the debris and vacuuming afterwards thorough. Appears this was more likely a prior owners issue. I'll be sure to open more up on Bricks A and B, clean thoroughly, inspect thoroughly and re torque all the nuts as well as replace any that I find in this situation with hopes I do not.

 

Well, thinking going to change plans and install the four best measuring of the 5 Bricks from the two packs she found. She's sort of wanting sooner than later to boot. Reasoning is, I just found out original Brick B looks as had some "custom" work done, that for some reason caused a rivet failure maybe. A failure that has me thinking and debating about pulling out with the bus bars installed on the one side, then compressing the block after a discharge and then repairing the broken rivet or moving forward with another route and that being the test Brick for customization like Dr. Kelley noted he did.

I'd almost compress and repair the rivet. Though that "custom" part. Therefore, going to replace all four Bricks now so I don't have to deal with the Brick balancing procedure and can think through more and refine that system for this system and later use. Will save time on the need to balance the Blocks and Bricks as well before startup.

Wondering, if leaving the car on overnight might somewhat perform a "Toyota Prius" series balance on the pack? I've suspected this happens with the NiMH packs, as I've done before to lower the Delta SOC % back to 0 on some shady packs that I had to use the shift to Neutral Hack When Stopping (with fan override and Dr Prius running always so can monitor temps, metrics & clear codes before an engine bad rev situation or worse) which prevents the HV pack from overcharging and overheating when a module is weak. I wouldn't drive a lithium pack like that if feasible to perform, however, seems like might help balance the pack leaving on.

Also, wondering if a little solder or spot weld might be better for that screw location loose terminal guessing situation, that is if the cells test good? I read those terminals are laser welded on. Yeah, not going to happen by me as no way in my possession.

Will also add here a link to GreenTech EV Auto. I'm guessing someone there figured out how to better fit the PRIME cells into the PiP-PHV pack. Seems like same or at least similar cell specs. https://greentecauto.com/hybrid-battery/toyota/prius-hybrid-batteries/toyota-prius-plugin-2012-2016/45ah-cells-48-months-warranty/

Oh, the joys of Prius ownership.

 

I definitely feel I was valid in insisting on purchasing a guaranteed with warranty know working hv pack. Anyways, way neat learning experience for the time being and possibly will be able to cobble something together that is effective for at least the short term.

Also, seeing how other than the uncertainty of the charge profile for the PiP there seems to be a feasible way to use a NiMH 28 module pack if can make a voltage divider to divide the 14 (if not 28 modules) blocks by two and pair four (or two if 28 modules) to make the 56 sense wires happy. Definitely would require a balanced pack to stay within voltage difference specs. Of which I am still wondering what the exacting metrics are to throw the range of HV pack caused DTC's.

Anyhow, progress with the first round of trying out what appeared metric wise the four better of the five Bricks she got.

I made a Discharge load with five 9003 bulbs and some 1/4" copper soft tube as bus bars and female spade connectors. I have to get some PlastiDip and dip the exposed copper when I get around, albeit porcelain was on my mind to make something nicer looking. Those female spade connectors were an amazingly close tight fit and works great with the XY-CD63L charger discharger control module. I haven't tested with the Reaktor in Discharge+ mode since that has a 6S limit and therefore would only use like maybe 2 or 3 bulbs.

So far only had to discharge Brick C and next will charge Block 7 to see if will bring in range. Took the VOLT DIFF down from 0.74-0.98 to 0.60-0.37. Delta SOC % was starting at 16% dropping to 2.5% with maybe 30 mins, where-as I didn't wait around to see that drop since started off at 6.5% and dropped to 6% in the minute or two I was looking at. My theory regarding Delta SOC % seems to hold true for the sitting max 0.49A Discharging PiP HV pack as well. Though way faster drop in Delta SOC % with these HV packs where I am guessing the below might be within spec with 15 to 30 mins just sitting. NiMH would take hours and up to a day. Guessing the Prius might start after charging Block 7 to get the blocks within balance unless there is some sort of individual of the 56 cell metrics that flags codes I am unaware of. However, not sure how will perform at higher Prius Discharge and Charging Currents. Definitely see why people made multicell data loggers to test the profiles of the packs. Will try to data log using one of the apps and graph to see performance once I get started and can drive under varying test conditions.

Am planning to put an original good Brick in to replace the present Brick D, though am playing around with to see what these Bricks she got can do and better get a hands on feel for these packs. Mainly, that is why I felt I needed the discharger ASAP. Gets those original charged Bricks that came with the Pip down to the Bricks charge she just got.

 

I am beginning to wonder if there is something off with the calibration of the smart unit that senses the voltage. Doesn't correlate with my readings. I think my spoofing method to discharge block 5 & 6 and charge block 7 is effective with the metrics per DrPrius seemingly. Not certain will be in regards to actually performance. Still throwing same codes, though getting closer as I increase charge of block 7, of course without patience to let the Delta SOC % decrease to out of the DrPrius red zone.

.

Update #1 since post: Performed 4S and 3S charge to bring up cells approximately 0.04V. 4.5A and approximately 10 minutes. Interestingly, as I was suspecting, metrics trended to improve. Will not clear codes using DrPrius. Will have to see if Preventative ON needs to be turned Off as well as clearing codes with Autel MAXIAP200 as did when started prior. Again, not expecting this to perform well under load, though will be interesting see what happens with my limited tool kit and time.

Thinking a block 5 discharge and maybe one more round of Block 7 charging. However, I'm going to do one more 0.04V approx 4.5A 4S and 3S charge to see effect. Thinking will bring VOLT DIFF below 0.11 MAX dynamic read.



Update #2: Only the VOLT DIFF max viewed went down to 0.19 with a low of 0.10. DELTA SOC % started and stayed stable at 2.50%. Preventative On wouldn't cancel so will disconnect 12V battery and see if waiting an hour or more will reset ECU's enough to allow.

 

Man, I'm stuck. Preventative On does cancel successfully after disconnecting the 12V battery and letting sit say an hr. Not sure why the PiP won't Power On READY. Hybrid codes P1A05, P1A0A, P1A64, P1A67 & P314A and the two ABS C1259 C1310.

Thinking for the PiP, investing in a better scan tool might be needed. Would be great to see live data for all the 56 cells as well.

Wondering what's causing the P1A05 and P1A0A in the battery voltage sensor circuit (a.k.a. glass unit) or elsewhere?

I almost want to start probing around for open circuits on traces that appear to be coming from the Brick C and D connectors, compared to not Brick A & B. Would be great if was a fuse, albeit will need the microscope to repair even if with ghetto larger part size fuse.

Looking back and wondering about say the "glass unit" going bad or some other issue besides the Bricks or Cells in the HV Pack, I see when the car started with the original pack second "glass unit" that came with, the last codes read were P1A64, P1A67, P314A and P31AB. Does read like closer to the same codes in @jacktheripper one video.

@mudder How's the Prius Gen 3 LiBSU or whatever will be called going? Wondering how will work in the 2012-2015 models since thinking for the price, worth having a more HV battery versatile option and guessing yours is more robust that this battery voltage sensor "glass unit" og BSU.