Getting some old Gen 1s back on the road

I have 6 Gen 1s that have been in storage a couple of years that I'm finally going to work on. One is a parts car, maybe another. One absolutely runs fine, it just needs some body work from a small wreck. Another started and drove around the block, but IIRC, the transmission didn't want to go in reverse or acted funky some other way. I've only seen the fifth one once - it's in a storage lot in Dallas I rent. It should be salvageable. The sixth one is the one I'm working on now and could use advice.

I was driving this one when I parked it 18 months ago because it started missing. It also had a steering problem with violent wheel wobble on occasion. I wasn't driving it much, but I'd run short errands with it.

When I first started it, it made a lot of rattling noise around the top of the engine. Orange triangle, CEL. I thought it had a bad pulley or something mechanical from all the noise. So, I pull the codes and get 3030, 0300, 0301, 0302, and 0304. So, I'm thinking all the noise is misfiring. Sure enough, I give it pedal, and it smooths out, sounds fine-ish.

So, I pulled the plugs and they look fine and the right type. I swapped in a set of coils off my wrecked car that runs and it made no difference, everything exactly the same.

Someone suggested that the "fuel maps" had to re-calibrate after the battery replacement. I took the load off the engine by putting it in Neutral, and almost all of the missing went away, but my HV battery was discharging.

I've run the car in Park to get the HV charged up, with all the missing, then run it in Neutral a bit to reset the fuel maps, and it's gotten noticeably better.

From the long sit, the car had a flat tire. My next step was to drive it and see it the missing would finally clear out. I drove about 10 miles in 3 different trips, and it never cleared up. Once I got up to speed and let off the pedal to cruise, it ran smoothly;; whenever I tried to get power, it misses. It still pulls the same codes.

I'm going to clean the MAF sensor today. There was signs of a squirrel's nest under the hood, but I dont seen any chewed wires/hoses. I don't think a squirrel would have set up home back when I was driving it regularly, which is when these issues started. I expect it camped out while the car sat for the last year, But, I'm going to look closer at those today anyway. I'm assuming that I an disconnect a vacuum line and if there is suction from it with the engine running, then the vacuum system has no leaks. If the suction is weak, there's a leak somewhere.

Not sure where to look after that except injectors. Certainly, it could be injectors, but they don't usually all fail (3 of 4) at the same time. Maybe it's a fuel pressure issue - need to research how to check fuel pressure on this car.

Could the 3030 issue (HV battery sensor) cause the missing??? The battery isn't charging up all the way like it should. My plan was to get the engine running right first, then dive into the battery. But maybe the battery is causing the engine problems?


Any advice appreciated. I

 

UPDATE: Cleaned the MAF sensor, no difference. But, I thought I'd disconnect one cylinder at a time to see how each one effected the engine. I pulled the electrical connector for #1, started it up, and it ran smooth at idle in Park (it was rattling, misfiring before). Thought, Bingo, that's it, something wrong with #1. Was about to swap coils and plugs on it, but I thought I should check the other ones. Plugged #1 back in and discoed #2. Same thing, runs smooth at idle. Same with #3. #4 is a PITA, so I skipped it, but I'm sure it's the same. I plugged them all back in and it misfires and rattles again.

Thought I'd see what it did if I drove it with #1 discoed. Cleared all the codes and drove around my block. Didn't misfire/rattle, but didn't have power, I think it was probably in cripple mode. Then, it slowed down to where it was inching along, and the HV battery was down to the low bar. I pulled over, plugged #1 back in, and it was back to misfiring and idle and whenever I got on the the pedal, but otherwise, it would run smooth-ish once I get cruising.

Does this new info raise any new red flags for anyone? Why does disconnecting any plug make the misfiring go away on the remaining cylinders? Does that indicate a fuel issue - not enough fuel pressure for all 4 cylinders. Can that explain the misfiring at idle in Park, but not Neutral?

Makes me wonder if I got bad gas - maybe back when I parked it, and it's only gotten worse since then? Is there an easy way to redirect the fuel line into a 5-gallon bucket of fresh gas?

Still haven't checked the vacuum lines - didn't even see any. I saw a link to a diagram somewhere. Until then, does any of these symptoms sound like it could be vacuum related? My service manual lists vacuum leak as a possible cause.

 

Hey Bisco, thanks for helping. I don't have TechStream. Just getting into these Gen 1s, I have a bunch of diesel trucks. For those, I just use a ScanGuage2, I've toyed with different Android apps, and OBDII Bluetooth, but my SG is already all programmed and just works (except the RJ clip being broke, #^%&)#^%). I'm a senior troll on the diesel forums, and with their help and the SG, I've fixed a lot of problems - after causing them.

I got a login to the SnapOn ProDemand app from a buddy who owns a garage, and it looks pretty complete with all the diagrams, DTCs info, disassembly/installation, diagnosis, etc.. If SG2 can support two vehicles, I can probably add some Prius gauges to it. Gotta have my truck supported though. So, just need to figure out if TechStream provides other capability that makes it worth buying. I expect that it does - seems like I checked once before years ago and the Prius wasn't fully supported by SC2. probably worth buying for the price the clones go for on Ebay. Maybe I have to buy an old XP laptop too?

Brian, I have pulled the spark plugs and coils, they show almost no corrosion or wear, as if they've been replaced already (car has 147k miles). Forget the name brand, they were double-whatever the metal is (platinum, iridium, something) Ditto on the coils and connectors. They all look clean and new-ish. I think one was a different brand than the others, again, like it had been replaced.

I put the plugs back in, but I swapped in known good coils from my parts car - no difference whatsoever, acted exactly the same, pulled all the same codes.

I pulled the MAF sensor off the airbox and harness. Sprayed it pretty good with CRC MAF cleaner. Didn't look dirty inside the o-ring, but the exterior was grimy. Cleaned it off too.

I haven't cleaned the throttle body yet. It seems to operate smoothly by hand; no sticking. Doesn't appear dirty in the typical sense of that word. It has the goldish hue one usually sees on fuel systems

 

Hey guys, thanks for all the responses. Sorry for the delay in my response - I expected to get email notifications that I'd gotten replies - may need to change account settings.

This car has 147k miles.

yes, I think you're right - when I disconnect a cylinder the engine just quits running; I thought it was smoothing out.

Thanks, Patrick, I didn't realize that one bad injector could cause multiple 030x faults. I have plenty of good injectors in my other cars and will swap those around to see if it makes a difference. It does act like my diesel when it has a bad injector - struggling under load but once you get up to cruising speed or take foot off pedal, it smooths out.

I had been thinking fuel pressure as well, although as I was cleaning the throttle body I see that the air intake tube from the grill has two large cracks in the "flex" section. Figure I'll duct tape that to confirm it's not the problem.

Reading elsewhere here - recommendations for a no-start that the owner spray starter fluid to confirm whether it's a fuel issue. Would that also work to confirm whether low pressure is causing the misfires?

Maybe I'll save compression check for last - since I don't have the gauge, lol, and since it seems to run smoothly when I give it pedal.

I'm really appreciative of everyone's help and am glad the "experts" give their time here. Please know that even though I can't add much value - yet - to this board, I'm paying your help forward on my diesel forum. I expect that by the time I get all my cars back on the road, I'll be a minor expert able to better contribute here.

Anyone need Gen 1 parts, I might help.

 

OK, the starting fluid does make the rattle go away, so I'm assuming I either have bad gas or a bad fuel pump/regulator.

 

Thank you, Mr. Wong! I had a bad #1 injector. Swapped in one from my other cars and it runs good now. I've ordered 4 refurbs. All the codes cleared except the 3030, but the battery meter popped up to full within a minute of driving and it's generating electricity just fine. However, it doesn't seem as peppy as I remember, and it says I'm only get 25mpg. Do those sound like symptoms of a 3030 issue? I don't see any leakage around the injectors.

I bought some Techron additive, but it says to add to a nearly empty tank, and mine's full. Guess I'll go on a road trip to run that gas out.

Also, I didn't depressurize the fuel rails when swapping, and I noticed that it seemed like I had more the pressure in my parts car - it really popped when I pulled the first injector out. My good car, not so much. But, I'm not getting any error codes for that, just the 3030.

I still have the orange triangle and CEL. My ScanGauge won't turn it off. Went to a tech I know, and his turned it off, for a second and they both came back on. I assume that's the 3030 code.

So, next step is to pull the battery out to see if I can find the broken wire. Debating whether to pull the battery out of my parts car to salvage its harness or just buy a new one. I'm a cheapskate, so it'll depend on how hard it is to get the battery out - do I want to do it twice knowing the harness in the parts car is 17 years old too?

Side note, I was still hoping that the parts car might be salvageable - the body is very nice, and the interior looks nice, but it was in a flood. However, after pulling off the air cleaner to get those injectors, the throttle body looks ugly. I'm guessing the water made it that high and got inside. probably not a good thing for the engine. When I pulled the injectors out, they were cruddy too. I had to borrow one from one of my good cars instead.

Any guesses as to whether any of the rest of the drive train would be usable?

 

LOL, Well, I spoke too soon. The engine still seems to run fine, but I took it out for a spin this evening and it died twice, I got a P3130 code, the PS light came on, the little red battery lit up on the dash, and the touchscreen started flickering. It started back up both times and I made it back home.

I felt what I think is the inverter coolant pump behind the driver's headlight and it wasn't vibrating, and there was no turbulence in the reservoir. I thought the battery and flickering might be my 12v battery - I have a good battery hooked up to the bad one in the trunk with jumper cables - I thought one of the cables just came loose. But no. I'm going to hook my charger/tester to it and see if its dead. The car's alternator is working - wouldn't that work its way through the jumper cables to keep my good battery charged? I guess not if the original battery is completely bad. Hopefully that's all it is. SYK, my son ordered the wrong battery for it - terminals on the wrong side - so I've just had it hooked up with cables until I get a new one.

The inverter coolant doesn't look like any coolant I've ever seen. Very murky looking. Is there a process for flushing it?

From what I've read, replacing the coolant pump is a PITA. You have to take the front bumper and headlight out? I wonder what the chances are that the one in my parts car is good. It was under water in the flood.

 

Just wondering...could a nearly dead 12v cause the inverter coolant pump to quit? I'd never had the 3130 code until yesterday, at the same time that I got all the other symptoms of a dead battery. Also, I meant to charge it last night, but I forgot to set my charger to AGM, so it was connected all night in Standard mode. My charger said it had 12.1 volts when I first connected it, and was at 60% of capacity, but now I wonder whether those were accurate readings since it wasn't in AGM mode. This morning, in AGM mode, it now says 12v and 7% capacity.

I'm ordering new batteries today, with the correct terminals.

 

OK, I replaced the 12v battery and all the strange symptoms went away. Not sure if it was someone here or on the Yahoo group that told me about U1R batteries, but I found one at Walmart for $22 and it seems to work fine. Thanks!

So, I gotta pull the HV battery and look for the 3030 problem next, and I need to change all the fluids, then this one will be ready to go.

I recharged that Optima and connected it to my next car with jumper cables again. It lit up the dash, but the car wouldn't turn over. The big red MAIN light came on in the touchscreen. I'll look it up, but I assume it means the HV battery is dead.

 

Thanks, Josey. That car seems to be running fine now, just not getting the MPG it should, which I figure is the 3030.

On my next car, I pulled codes and got 0100, 0110, and 3030. I think the first two are probably because I left the MAF sensor unplugged - this is the car I swapped the injector from to fix my other car. I'll check in the morning. Between the 3030 and the MAIN light/exclamation car, I figure I got HV battery issues. IIRC, it drove funny the only time I tried when I brought it home from the auction a couple of years ago, so I'll probably have more issues once I can get it started.

Looks like I'll be learning a lot about HV batteries here shortly.

Thanks for all the help everyone.

 

Thanks, Patrick. Your suggestion that just one injector could be causing multiple cylinder misfires was right on. Took them out and #1 was fouled. Swapped in a good one from another car, and it runs smooth. Don't think I have a pump problem - it was just a bad 12v battery. I assumed, stupidly, that it would be recharging through the jumper cables, but the original battery was completely shot, so no. Once I got a new battery, it's running fine.
All I got now, on that car, is the 3030. I've already swapped that battery into Car 2, which was also giving me a 3030, but wouldn't start. With this battery, it started right up, albeit without showing Ready until I turned the key to Start.

I just set up the battery related Xcommands in my Scan Gauge and it shows 309 volts in the working battery at 59% charge. Can't get to the street with that car because of others in the way, and it's the one I stole a good injector from, so now it's misfiring on that bad one. I've ordered replacement injectors so should have it running smoothly soon.

So, two HV batteries, two 3030s, one starts, one doesn't. Do you have a link to a good article/vid on how to check the modules in the non-starting battery? I'm an idiot about electrical issues. The sticky here shows how to replace, but doesn't tell how to figure out which to replace. Maybe the non-starter just needs a new bus bar, whatever, and if fixed could be recharged? It started when I first got it home on that battery, but it's been sitting 2 years since then.

I posted another thread on Car #3 - no start, no ready, codes for the ECM and ECU. What do you think my chances are of swapping in those modules, plus batteries, and getting it to start? I see used computers online, but if they're not hard to swap, I have known good ones here. If I read correctly, I'd have to allow them to sync up for 30 mins; just wouldn't want to mess them up, such that I can't put them back in my good car after testing with them.