Nexpower/Project Lithium Battery Issue - Blade #12 Failure?

it definitely looks like that module has seen better days. The pack is around 12 or 13 months old? How long do you have coverage from NexPower?

 

I have notified Jack of your issue, he should get back to you shortly.

 

Hi @JasonMRC ,

Thanks for the screenshots, it looks like the M8 nuts at blade #12 is loosed causing the double IR. I would recommend to open up the metal case and make sure all M8 nuts got secured to 3 ft-lbs. of torque.

Also, if you have the V2.0, we will upgrade you to the new V3 sodium-ion battery, feel free to send pictures to [email protected] and we will help you get back on the road.

Best Regards,
Jack

 

That's pretty good check that out and see if that's the case seems perfectly reasonable but not good but reasonable assumption.

 

@JasonMRC , Please give an update if you found any loose nuts on the blade terminals?

 

So Jack sent you a v3 battery on Monday 8/12 even before you checked for loose nuts today, Saturday, 8/17. Jack knew it was not a loose nut and that it was a bad blade. Hopefully, the v3 sodium-ion battery will work better than the v2 LiFePo battery. I assume the v3 that you received is a prototype battery and not the production v3.

 

I don't know if it's certain Jack knew that, or just wanted to get a replacement en route so the OP could get back on the road promptly in any case. Could be read either way.

 

Yes, I agree with you. I applaud Jack for being very proactive in sending the v3 battery so quickly. I am guessing that Jack has seen this problem many times with the v2 battery, and he wanted to take care of this customer. From what I have read in this forum, Jack is very good when dealing with warranty issues for his batteries.

 

Hey All,

I'm having almost the exact same issue. I'll grab some photos in a bit, but it looks like I have a single bad blade in my battery. Really bummed about this as I paid a ton for the battery and hardly used it (put less than 15-20k miles on it in 2-3 years). Hoping it's just a quick fix by replacing a bad blade, but I'm kinda scared these V2's (and V1s) were not as high quality as I had hoped.

Any advice on moving forward Jack? I'll be shooting an email regardless soon to figure out what I can do to salvage the battery/get it working again.

 

read this thread:p3000-code-with-new-nexpower-v2-5-battery.254854

 

Already posted in that thread, but half my messages sit as "waiting for moderator". Either way I've spoken to the owner and he's just trying to upsell me a new battery for almost a grand. With how long this battery lasted, I have no idea why anyone would spend more money with the company in hopes they can "fix it this time". The first battery was a whopping 2400, which is just insane for how long it lasted.

I genuinely want to know from him/his team how a battery in a climate-controlled evnironment after 15k miles and under 2 years has failing packs.

I also feel that there might be some people hostile to Nexpower staff/team, but at the same time, I think there's a bit of a cover-up with how big of a risk/liability these V2/V2.5's are. If I was a business owner and saw how serious the issues were with V2 and 2.5s, I would have been more adamant with recalling them or warrantying them.

I hope to god there isn't some news article about someone's house burning down (or worse).

 

The problem is they used lithium cells without a lithium battery management system (bms). The beginning of the end was at least one fire reported here with pics. They had warnings from an engineer they elected not to hire but that guy was shut down by our moderator and lawsuit threats from the company.

It will likely happen and the company will hide behind their LLC.

 

I have no problem bringing this up to relevant agencies in California. He can duck all he wants behind an LLC but at the end of the day I have no issue making sure people know his products are inherently unsafe and are huge fire hazards. I'm having a paid electrical engineer look at the battery as we speak (it's headed onto our personal lift at our automotive shop in an hour or so).

I've had him in Emails telling me multiple times to just pay out and have him repair the battery/replace it. I'm going to take the battery out today, document everything, and file all information to relevant agencies. I have also no problem cold-calling their potential customers/vendors/distributors and explaining the situation to them. It's just not worth the risk for most companies.


Fun Fact: once I report this, there's a good chance people who have this modification won't be allowed to park their cars in certain places (obviously if it's known this modification was done). No way in hell is a reputable company going to allow someone to park a lithium bomb on their property/garage/enclosure. I actually parked the car in the field after finding out how dangerous it is.

 

On a side note, Is there any way to MAKE a correct BMS system to make this even work? I'm betting a lot of this cannot be avoided without high-voltage power regulation or some sort of high charge/discharge offload bank (IE a power source just to mediate spikes and direct that impact off from the lipos). I'm a curious soul so if anyone wants to jump on a discord call and explain to me a solution, I'm all ears. We have 5+ gen 1-2 priuses here, and a LOT of these vehicles are essentially flashlights (once the batteries die, it's useless for even pet projects). Having an ACTUAL working DIY BMS system to convert stuff might be clunky/large/take up the trunk, but it would be a good step in making sure less stuff ends up in a landfill. I'd love some BMS/battery setup that's made with just a bunch of RC-style or even solar-battery-sized packs (so you can fix/swap bad packs and stuff). An example of practical usages/purposes for a customizable BMS would be the G1/G2 Priuses powering houses/acting as generators for UPSes, as I see people create on here/other sites.

I'm not a PCB/electrical engineer, but I just got done sending a 4 layer PCB to oshpark, so making a custom circuit (or having it laid out and printed from someone else's schematics) wouldn't be too crazy. I messaged the other gentleman who posts on the issue commonly on Reddit and asked him a similar question.

On another note, the amount of people slandering that dude is insane. I'm very passionate about a lot of stuff, and can get hotheaded when people are stubborn with stuff I'm really skilled in, and I feel that's probably what happened in that situation. That being said, safety (especially with lipos) is a huge huge deal to me and any concerns over these batteries (and the fact NO RECALL WAS DONE FOR A HUGE INSURANCE LIABILITY OR NOTICE TO CUSTOMERS) is like................such a huge deal I'm amazed people were trying to project him as some crazy guy trying to ruin Nexpower's reputation. Nearly every single one of his facts is correct, especially about V2 and 2.5. I see the circuit for 2.5, it's just....................yeah that's some hack shit. Sorry.

I'm very confused and concerned why some people on this site are defending this when it's clear all these packs are ticking timebombs. It's not a matter of IF, it's WHEN the next pack will explode/catch the car on fire.

 

The strange thing was you could buy brand new Toyota nimh for the same price and easily get ten to fifteen troublefree years, just like the original cells. The sales pitch for aftermarket lithium was extended ev range (maybe 2.5 miles) and more power (also questionable but taking advantage of the factory bms thinking the nimh cells were overcharged). The early advocates received "beta" lithium and discount codes to hand out for commissions.

Many of us with background knowledge were asking how a factory nimh bms was interfaced to an appropriate lithium bms. Trade secret until failures occurred and it was determined voltage feedback was modified to avoid codes.

Toyota offered lithium and the appropriate bms in gen3 Prius v's sold in other countries. The packs were installed under the middle console leaving room for a third row in those v's. That gen3 was sold through 2022 using the same 1.8L gen3 engine config with updated pistons, rings, head gasket, egr valve, intake and software.

 

Oh, absolutely. I wasn't into BMS/Battery tech 2-3 years ago, but now I'm decently hip on how the basics work and knew coming back to this pack after it threw an error was going to be a shit-show. I was really hoping it was just going to be at most pulling the battery and having Nexpower service/replace the battery (since it's obvious it's a huge liability/a dud) with maybe me paying for shipping, but I cannot fathom spending more money with his company.

Not only that, but he wants the old battery back AND 1300 dollars. I feel that EITHER/OR is acceptable, but me sending it back just makes no sense at all. I can easily get my old core refurbished and the car sold off, which is what will most likely happen. I'll take the old battery, tear it apart, document how badly it performed/of a condition the cells are in after FIFTEEN THOUSAND MILES and also include Jack's "please I'm going bankrupt give me 1300$ or you're screwed" emails with the documentation.

 

. $1300?

I thought these prices were high.