Gen.2 Price of HYBRID batterie$ are thru the roof=What are the future options?

What does the video you just linked have anything to do with what we are talking about? It doesn't matter if the battery won't blow up like a lithium ion battery...............the BMS/battery packs for the v2 and 2.5s are badly designed and the fact that the only argument against them being defective is "well they won't explode" is just insanely silly.

The fact is Nexpower sold dangerous batteries, then immediately did a "very soft" recall on a very dangerous issue speaks a ton on possible future experiences, even if they change the BMS or battery chemistry.

Again, this is why in some countries you need an engineering degree/license to do the stuff Jack is doing (because it IS dangerous/hazardous, including to potential consumers). You can't just go "my bad, buy my new battery and try again".

 

If you look hard and long enough, you can always find someone crying and wining about something.
NO product is perfect. That is why there are "prototypes". To find the weak points and fix them.
They are not built like the final product, because they are TESTing them. Don't expect them to be
built like the final product.

When I needed a new hybrid battery, I was going to buy the OEM pack from Toyota. But the guy said
they can't sell them over the counter any longer. At least not in Florida. I've done a lot of business with
this dealers parts department and they have always been great with me, and price wise have been fair. NO complaints.

So I looked elsewhere. What a pain! One place close to me said he had them in stock. He was an hour's drive
from me so I told him I'd be their in an hour. Then he said they weren't actually "here", he'd ship it from his
warehouse in another state. That flew up a red flag. Other places online, and ebay, all kinda flacky.

I had read all the remarks, positive and negative, about Jack and his lithium pack. But his cost was less than everyone
else's packs. Eventually, I decided to give it a try. If he didn't ship it in the time stated on his web page, I'd contact him
and expect a refund, now, not weeks or months later. If he didn't, I'd call my credit card bank and tell them what's
going on and they would get the refund for me. So I wasn't worried about that.

I went on his web page, ordered it. It came back as "out of stock". New stock in 7-10 days I think it was.
I said, okay, I can wait 2 weeks. The next day I received an email saying they had arrive and will be shipped soon.
3-4 hours later I received another email with a tracking number saying it had shipped!!!
I expected about a week from California, I'm in Florida. It came in 3 days!

Installation was almost exactly like Jack said. Pretty straight forward. I checked the voltage of each block. All were
within 1 tenth of a volt or less.

On my first drive with the new lithium battery, I noticed a huge difference over the oem pack. My mpg went up. The
distance in ev mode went up. Everything Jack said about the battery, was correct. Everything he said about installing
it was correct. I had some issue and questions about the installation, and wanted to make sure I was doing things
correctly because there are only connections on one side of the battery. Except for 1 block for the disconnect.
He returned my texts very quickly. I was a happy camper!!!!

About 4 months later he contacted me and asked me to be a tester for the new Sodium pack because it was very
hot and super humid this past summer here. I said sure! He informed me that this is a prototype pack, not the final version.
He said the installation might not be as straight forward as the lithium pack. And he was correct. I noted the issues
and let him know. Overall, it was not a difficult installation.

When I drove it for the first time, I noticed a big difference over the lithium pack. It keeps the charger longer.
Recharges quicker. EV length is further. MPG went up about 2mpg. I was driving faster on the highway, and sportier
in the city with the lithium, and the mpg went up about 4mpg over oem. My average in the city was 38mpg, with the Sodium,
it's 42mpg. I can easily get 48pmg on the highway, but if I drive a little slower, I can get 50-52mpg.

As a test prototype pack, I've only had very minor issues, if you can consider them issues. It's never overheated.
And stays between 140-180 degrees, depending on driving conditions. The temps might be lower, I don't remember
exactly. Unless I'm sitting in the city, then it goes up to 195 or so. It's never gotten to 200 degrees. I tried different
ways that Jack asked me to try, to test the pack and get it to overheat, but can't.
Only 1 block had a little lower voltage then the others. Well within tolerence, but a little low. He sent me a replacement.
Remember, Prototype, Test Pack. This is what TESTING is for.

I Replaced the lithium hybrid battery with Sodium battery on 19 September 2024. At 352,929 miles.
I am at 369,768 miles now. And no problems! I'm not even trying to get higher mpg, but am getting them.
I have NO issues whatsoever with either pack.

Jack has been super helpful, and quick to respond to any question or concerns.
All the negative things posted against him, he proved were incorrect. I CERTAINLY recommend him and his
product! I am NOT an easy person to make happy when it comes to customer satisfaction. I have a very
high standard. Jack has certainly met those standards for me!

Some people just like to complain and will look for any reason to be miserable to make other's feel like them.
They just like to cause trouble. Usually from a competitor. Because perhaps their product is not so good so they have to
try to make other products look bad to try to make theirs seem better??? Buyer beware!

I'm certain, the final Sodium pack will be a higher standard then the test packs.

 

You (and Jack possibly) clearly have no idea how "slander" laws work. I have a pack. I am a customer. My pack is in a hazardous state, which was determined by a qualified electrical technician. I'd love to post images of the blade in question (it's a doozy) but since we're throwing around legal claims, I'll hold onto those image and absolutely encourage you or Jack to "file slander charges" or whatever silly crap you are talking about.

I'll hold onto this 15,000 mile V2 pack and also have a masters degree holding electrician on standby in case you want to take this to any court in California or the US for that matter. I hope Jack has proper proof to show these packs are safe/functional, specifically the V2 and 2.5 Nexpower Prius Gen 2 Battery Replacement. If not, this is just going to cost him/you/whomever cash and I'd love to post the entire ordeal here for people to see how Nexpower handles Criticism.

Again, please follow up and file the required court paperwork. I don't think it's gonna pan out for you as you think, but shoot your shot, Tex.

P.S.

Did you just seriously threaten to Dox/leak my personal information over me telling people to stay away from Nexpower batteries because my own (and other batteries sold by them in the V2 and V2.5 Prius Gen 2 lineup) had issues?

Do the admins of the site really allow that kind of talk? This is really just insane at this point. Wow.

 

There is no "perfect" product. There are defects, it happens, welcome to life. Look at the head gasket and egr system
of the 3rd Generation Prius.....
So I guess EVERY Prius, every Toyota is dangerous, is terrible, and too dangerous to buy.....

 

There's really one active mod here as far as I know, and it's a lot of work, and I get the impression he hasn't really got time to evaluate posts "on the merits", as it were, but does respond when something starts spiraling into being a nasty thread.

If I remember right about the earlier thread that did end up with words from the mod (and the site owner too, as I recall), that really happened after the conversation went off into lessons on slander law and who could afford the biggest retainers and other legal biggdickery.

 

Who, the Maytag Repair man?

Ask John (Mudder) how that turned out for him on this forum and how he had to cease and desist his slander of a business. Personal slander is going to go nowhere or BlackJimbob would have been in prison by now and that didn't happen but if a business has lost revenue stream due to unsubstantiated claims and slander about it's products and services you better hire someone better than the Maytag Man to represent you.

 

Ok, I'll ask. How did that go, @mudder? We know about the temporary PriusChat ban when an earlier thread descended into legal biggdickery. Other than that, have you legally had to cease and desist anything?

 

ok this thread is getting awry.. now lets talk about politics!!

 

All I'm saying is if you think I'm slandering Nexpower by stating they poorly designed batteries (namely the V2 and 2.5 prius batteries they sold), and they are a safety hazard to be utilized, then by all means stop talking about it here and file the proper paperwork. I'll have my legal team handle it and make sure I'm involved only as much as I need to be. I'll keep my own battery, my own receipts, and my own blades that have been severely damaged in less than 10,000 miles because of poor battery construction quality or design.

A prime example is how the batteries in the V2 and 2.5 are connected. You cannot solder batteries the way he did at all, it's a battery basics 101. If you genuinely think you can get in ANY respectable court of law a positive verdict over criticism of the V2/2.5's construction with shit like that happening...........good luck.

For V3, I have no idea but I'm kinda still stuck on the fact Jack sold knowingly bad designed batteries and is trying to dodge a full recall/hoping time expires on the warranties so he can wash himself of the situation. This is on top of the clear astroturfing/referral link/mob mentality going on. I'm linking this stuff to colleagues now and most of them are kinda just stunned people are "that passionate" (or financially invested) to talk about "doxing" someone over a battery review.

Shame too, because I'm sure there's plenty he's done (and is doing) that helps the Prius community at large.

 

So where is your design?

Talk is cheap......

 

Is this because you now acknowledge that your old products are poorly designed?
If so, what changed and when do you plan to recall those products?
Or are you just hoping that nothing bad ever happens as each unit ultimately fails?

Which 'old' patent are you referring to:
-Your original 2021 patent, which you recently amended (2025FEB20), and still haven't withdrawn, or;
-your nearly identical 2024 followup patent, which is also still pending?

Regardless, USPTO records makes it clear you are still actively attempting to get these 'old' patents granted.

I suspect you're referring to the "47Ah LiBCM Kit" I sell that uses Samsung SDI modules? If so:
-yes, Samsung SDI recently recalled ~QTY125000 lithium modules due to a higher-than-normal failure rate.
-This recall is not specific to my "47Ah LiBCM Kit"; Jeep, Ford, and Audi are affected, too.
-These manufacturers are only replacing modules in vehicles whose software detects the issue.
-Since LiBCM can detect the same defects, I am working to add similar detection methods, which would alert my customer prior to failure.
-I've only shipped QTY50 LiBCM Kits that use recalled Samsung SDI modules.
-I am very public about this recall, as one should be when a safety issue is discovered.
-My beta customers are aware that this recall exists.
-My expected failure rate is one vehicle in five years. Obviously not ideal, but overall the risk is small (and detectable prior to thermal runaway).

Regarding this recall, you've recently added the following (false) claim to your website:

Your statement is incorrect for at least the following reasons:
-No customer using my LiBCM BMS has reported 'puffed up' modules. The customer who reported puffed Samsung cells (still) has not received my LiBCM Kit. Instead, he purchased Samsung SDI modules from a 3rd party. Upon inspecting those modules – again, which had never been connected to my product – they observed that the modules were swollen.
-Samsung SDI is a reputable lithium cell manufacturer. You make it sound like I designed a hybrid battery using undersized cells that weren't fit for purpose, which then failed because they couldn't handle demanding loads (as was the case with your undersized V2.5 and prior cells). The truth is these Samsung modules are specifically designed for use in vehicles.

The Samsung SDI recall is already in the news, because a reputable manufacturer won't hide known defects from their customers (like you do). The Samsung SDI recall is unfortunate for me, yes, but I wouldn't characterize my product as "already going downhill". Recalls happen, and when they do we deal with them. It's impossible to engineer a perfect product, but proper engineering design principals minimize the risk to our customers. And when the risk is too high, any reputable manufacturer will recall the product.

One key difference between us is that I'm very public about defects in my products (including this recall). And yes, it's unfortunately for me, but the root cause is beyond my control; Jeep, Ford, Audi, and I are all dealing with the same defective Samsung SDI cells. The key difference here is that my products are fundamentally designed for safety (see ISO26262), whereas yours are lacking basic SCADA engineering safeguards. Related: does NexPower have an accredited electrical engineer on staff? If so, why aren't they responding to my safety claims?

Over the past year I've raised numerous safety issues with numerous NexPower products. Your team has repeatedly failed to address those concerns. Just last week I received yet another private message from one of your customers asking for advice on whether or not they should keep your crackpot Signal Soother product installed. I thought you sent all these customers a recall notice (which obfuscated the actual reason by claiming the SS caused radio interference).

The closest attempt you made to respond to a concern I raised was in response to my (correct) claim that your V3 prototype units lacked an HVDC fuse and bypassed the service disconnect. However, even in that response you attempted to gaslight me into thinking that this was somehow acceptable on a product simply because it was 'beta' (so what?) and/or 'old' (as you know, it was less than two months old). Fuses are important no matter what development stage your product is in; service disconnects prevent repair technicians from coming into contact with HVDC. The fact that you don't/didn't understand that is a huge red flag. Someone could have died from your carelessness. IMO, you are lucky nobody did. For your sake, I hope you've recalled all these beta units.

Based on my experience, NexPower exhibits a pattern of ignoring valid feedback, refusing to accept accountability when design defects are discovered, or even to address good-faith criticism. I would love for NexPower to publicly acknowledge its past product safety issues, and to make good faith efforts to respond to valid criticism.

Instead, NexPower attempts to discredit and mask feedback. NexPower's safety design philosophy is vastly different from mine:
-my method: use engineering methods to properly design a safe product; publicly acknowledge issues; support customers publicly; issue full refunds to any customer who asks (only happened once).
-your method: disregard best practices for ASIL-C systems, including SCADA; discard valid concerns and shoot the messenger; privately weave a web of lies to your customers, who you support privately; fail to recall known defective products; force customers to pay for warranty replacements.

...

Look how much time we've wasted bickering back and forth. Imagine if you had been open to my initial feedback 18 months ago... in that time we could have worked together to solve your issue and design a properly engineered product. Instead, today you're still selling a product without a BMS, I'm still working on my own competing product, and we're both still spending countless hours sparring.

 

Please let me know if I'm missing something specific to how the Prius measures temperature...

...but unless you're using Kelvin, those temperatures exceed the specified 70 degC max sodium cell temperature. /s
I assume you're using Fahrenheit:
180 degF ~= 82 degC (12 degC above max allowed temp)
200 degF ~= 93 degC (23 degC above max allowed temp)

Given the poor sodium cell ESR I measured in my testing (on both prototype and production cells), I'm not surprised to see temperatures this high. So much for NexPower's "lower ESR than OEM" claim.

I completely disagree.
Specifically, Jack has failed to address several dozen safety claims I've made over the past 18 months. Since Team Jack has successfully bullied several website admins/moderators into taking my itemized claims list down, I've contemplated just hosting them myself. Let me know if you're interested in reviewing these claims and I'll do that.

I agree with your cautionary "Buyer Beware!".

Alternate take:
Some people like safe products, and will raise objection when unsafe defects are found.

It's not. I have one. It's nearly identical to the prototype unit I reviewed last summer. The two biggest differences are:
-fuse/disconnect aren't bypassed (thank god), and;
-different cells (which perform slightly differently, but not enough to make a difference).

 

We've already gone down this road. Jack's legal team has my address. Yawn.

This is new.
@Tideland Prius, does PriusChat now allow threats like this?

I know of at least QTY6 NexPower customers who have experienced thermal events. Most of them do not post publicly, as they fear retribution from NexPower and/or Team Jack. Regardless, three customers HAVE publicly disclosed thermal events.

 

Correction:
Jack's legal team has yet to silence me in any way.
Frankly, they're still struggling to spell my name correctly.

 

No.

 

I don't know where those temperatures came from.... Brain Fart???
Included is a screen shot of the temps....


.....it's never overheated...
And stays between 140-180 degrees, depending on driving conditions. The temps might be lower, I don't remember
exactly. Unless I'm sitting in the city, then it goes up to 195 or so. It's never gotten to 200 degrees. I tried different
ways that Jack asked me to try, to test the pack and get it to overheat, but can't.
Only 1 block had a little lower voltage then the others. Well within tolerence, but a little low. He sent me a replacement.
Remember, Prototype, Test Pack. This is what TESTING is for.