does the Prius enable sprawl?

My thought is, regardless of how you feel about "suburban sprawl", that horse out of the barn, for the most part. In much of the country having a Prius simply makes the best of an existing situation.

 

Urban sprawl's been around far longer than the Prius, and I don't see why it would contribute more or less than other cars. Zoning is as much to blame as anything - residential, industrial, and commercial areas are seemingly placed as far away from each other as possible. The nicest neighbourhoods in my city, and probably many others, are remnants of the streetcar era, when pretty much everything was clustered around the transit stop.

 

Yup, no doubt.

But you could make the argument about any efficiency gain. Raising CAFE provides an encouragement to sprawl as well.

As for the cost.. to generalize, everything is more expensive the closer you get to the city. I would think cost is rarely a reason to move closer to an urban center. To me it's more about access. I really couldn't imagine living 30 miles away from the city, where any trip to the city becomes a major event (I grew up 30 miles from a city, so I know first-hand).

I don't think you're overthinking anything. Until we change public policy to dis-incentivize sprawl, it's going to continue.

 

Even at 42 mpg you are doing better than 95% of the cars on the road. It sounds like you are a PERFECT candidate for a Nissan leaf!

6 miles a day,, falling off a log with an EV.

 

Not that you've got the money burning a hole in your pocket, but you can convert your new prius into a Plug in Prius. Once the charge from the plug in is exhausted, it reverts to normal Prius operating mode.

Just a thought.....

 

i think you're making daniel's point from another thread: we are driving more because we are getting mileage. i was skeptical, but it seems to be your train of thought.

 

So you won't get the best MPGs on the forum, but how was the MPGs on your previous car? what percentage of improvement have you seen there - plus, you are contributing less emissions with the Prius, so you are helping to ratchet down pollution.

Yes, an EV would be nice. Your bus pass is better. We all have to live in reality, however, and occasionally, maybe mostly, you will need to drive somewhere.
Hey, maybe you could ride a bike to the bus station?

 

I don't believe that Prius significantly encourages sprawl. Fuel has never been the majority of a car's operating cost, or even the largest cost on recent models. Depreciation is larger until the vehicle gets older. Insurance, financing, maintenance, repairs, parking, etc. add up to a lot. Prius cuts the fuel portion in half, and repairs by a smaller fraction, but doesn't help the rest.

Another huge cost to sprawl is the time consumed by longer commutes. Prius doesn't help that either.

While people living further away pay less per mile of commute, the miles increase much faster than the rate drops. The total price only gets higher with distance.

The "horse is out of the barn" comment did not imply that sprawl has ended. It began long before Prius was invented, and would still be continuing even if hybrids and modern EVs were not available. I don't see them as saving enough money or any commute time to be a substantial driver of additional sprawl.

 

Of course fuel efficient cars promote sprawl. If the best technology could do was 10 mpg, do you think I would have bought a weekend house 75 miles away?

At some point, the time with your butt in the seat of a car offsets fuel cost.

Criteria for selecting a weekend house, can I commute in on a Monday morning? I'm willing to get up at 4:30am and leave at 5:20am to get to work, but I'm not willing to get up a 3:00am.

A five door that can be loaded in a garage was a major requirement. Don't want to be going outside in the rain to load up to go back to the city.

 

At one time few people ever traveled more than 30 miles from their place of birth. Improved transportation changed this dramatically. All improvements in transportation have influenced living patterns, but as others have pointed out, many other factors are in play. I suspect you are over-thinking the whole thing.

Tom

 

I don't think that the economy of the Prius will create new housing developments on the outskirts of town, but it may make that kind of urban sprawl more affordable. In the end, driving daily from beyond the edge of town and back in a Prius is better that the same commute in a less efficient car.

 

... and then some radical had to go and invent the wheel.

 

For a car (any car) not to promote sprawl, it would have to be too painful to travel far in it. (financial pain, physical pain, emotional pain, etc.)

The question you need to ask: Do people who own a Prius drive more because it is cheaper, or do people who drive more buy a Prius because it is cheaper?

 

Just rent a car for those occasions and Bob's your uncle.

 

This is sort of a Jevon's Paradox question, isn't it?

 

Bob is also the name of my main computer. All of my computers are named Bob in one form or another.

Tom