Strange surging during very slow speed braking, stopped

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by NotSoOld, Sep 13, 2023.

  1. NotSoOld

    NotSoOld New Member

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    Good Evening Fellow Prius owners,

    I own a 2013 Prius that has an issue that I am absolutely failing to find on Google or this forum. During the last few mph's coming to full stop, there is a feeling that can be described as a surging, uneven deceleration similar to a warped rotor. However, I can also replicate the surging while at a complete stop by partially releasing the brake pedal to the point where the car is barely being kept still but wants to move forward.

    I know the Prius tries to simulate an ICE car when you lift the brake pedal by moving forward without pressing the accelerator and it seems this intermittent surging issue is somehow related to that.

    Any insight is highly appreciated, thank you for reading.
     
  2. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    I think you need to clean your throttle body
     
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  3. NotSoOld

    NotSoOld New Member

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    I don't think it has anything to do with the ICE side of the car. The surging happens while on Electric power.
     
  4. Tombukt2

    Tombukt2 Senior Member

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    And sensor clean off too MAF map etc
     
  5. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    Does it feel like the engine power is surging (which the two previous replies seem to be getting at), or like the braking force is not holding steady?

    It can happen that one of these older Prii can develop an internal leak in the brake system, where the brake fluid pressure bleeds off slowly. If you are applying the brakes while this happens, there can be a cycle where the pressure at the brakes slowly decreases, and the system notices and opens valves to bring the brake pressure back up, and it slowly decreases again. Sometimes if the environment is not too noisy you can hear soft clicks near the firewall when the system boosts the pressure up again (which would coincide with feeling more forceful braking again). In some cases, the clicks might come with a sort of quack or bark noise.

    Also, sometimes, you can catch the same thing happening with the car not moving at all, if you just hold the brake pedal pressed, and listen for a sort of repeating valve-click sound near the firewall every couple seconds, with or without a little quack.
     
  6. Tombukt2

    Tombukt2 Senior Member

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    have this in two 08 now . accumulator bleed down whilst in operation.
     
  7. sam spade 2

    sam spade 2 Senior Member

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    I think he first needs to check his rotors for rust.

    Mine does something similar to that if it sits out in the rain or high humidity for a couple of days without being used.
    Where he lives, that could be the situation almost EVERY day.

    A couple of "firm" stops from speed or intentionally dragging the brakes at cruising speed eliminates it.

    It feels the way it does because the mechanical brakes don't actually make contact if
    the regen braking is slowing down enough. The brakes don't actually engage
    every time you push lightly on the pedal.
     
  8. NotSoOld

    NotSoOld New Member

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    It feels like it is surging but this happens while the engine off and car is under electric power at a stop light, so I don't see how cleaning the throttle body and MAF sensor will do anything. If I lift off the brake pedal slightly, the car feels like it switches between trying to go forward and disengaging power, if that makes sense.

    I suppose it could be a problem with the brakes, assuming the car is constantly putting power to the electric motor regardless of how much pressure is applied to the brake pedal. However I was under the assumption power cuts off when the brake is applied.

    I will try to test for hissing when I can get to a quiet place.

    I've done a few high speed braking runs while switching to neutral. It doesn't feel like it's anything on the rotors. I have had the wheels off recently and the rotors also looked and felt ok.
     
    #8 NotSoOld, Sep 14, 2023
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 14, 2023
  9. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    There is a certain pedal pressure above which that is true. You can find it by watching the display page with the little car and the arrows, and finding how hard you have to press the pedal to make the arrow to the electric motor go away.

    As soon as you're not pressing quite that hard, it sends power to the motor again, all part of the game to fool you into thinking it's your grandfather's automatic transmission wanting to creep forward.
     
  10. NotSoOld

    NotSoOld New Member

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    It seems to be the brake booster... pumping the brake causes the booster to run continuously. Is replacement a DIY friendly option?
     
  11. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    Pumping the brake enough will make anybody's booster pump run. (It's the booster pump you're hearing, which is separate from the booster. The booster is silent.)

    The better question would be, if you just hold the brake applied, no pumping, do you hear a repeated clicking or thumping sound (with maybe also the sound of the booster pump again, briefly, after every so many clicks/thumps)?
     
  12. NotSoOld

    NotSoOld New Member

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    I will try and check when I get the chance. Really appreciate your help and knowledge sir.
     
  13. NotSoOld

    NotSoOld New Member

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    As you've described, there are repeated clicking sounds, when coming to a stop and holding the brake. It doesn't happen at every stop though.
     
  14. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    Probably time to start budgeting for an actuator.
     
  15. NotSoOld

    NotSoOld New Member

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    Unfortunate...

    Thanks again for your insight!