http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Prius-2G/message/45895 From: "Billy Bob" <doublecrownroyal@...> Date: Mon Nov 21, 2005 9:11 pm Subject: Re: ECU Malfunction doublecrownr... I am a Certified Toyota and ASE Master Technician and was in the first Prius certification class on the West Coast. I have pasted an announcement from Toyota Technical Information Service, which is not available to the public. I have also seen on Dealer Daily, also not available to the public, two announcements which may help shed some light. I also took some time today to call a friend at Technical Assistance and he confirmed for me that it appears that the malfunction was caused by a corrupt file in the reprogramming function of the software, and no external causes have been found in any of the ECM's returned to Toyota thus far. He also mentioned that yes, there is an unbelievable backlog in shipping replacements due to the fact that THEY MUST BE MANUFACTURED FIRST! It sounds like your service guy is giving you the straight dope. Coincidentally, my friend said that the first reports of an error were from Oregon. That really sounds like your tech was on the ball, and has done his job well. Here are the messages from Toyota: What's New in TIS Updated: 11/17/2005 ATTENTION: DO NOT USE VERSION 13.1A SCANTOOL SOFTWARE FOR VEHICLE REPROGRAMMING. Analysis of recent ECU failures has revealed that version 13.1a software is at fault. A new software version 13.2a is undergoing validation and is scheduled to be released in December. In the mean time, to avoid damaging ECUs, revert all scantools to version 13.0a immediately. Version 13.1a may only be used for non- reprogramming diagnostics on 2006 Prius, RAV4 and IS250/350. From Dealer Daily: Published on: 11/03/2005 12:00 AM On October 28, version 13.1a scantool software was released to dealers via TIS. Although each release is extensively validated prior to distribution, we have received a number of reports of ECU reprogramming failure when conducting SSC 50P for 2004-2005 Prius. In some cases the Engine ECU may be damaged. As an immediate countermeasure, we are recommending that all dealers revert to the previous version of scantool software (V13.0a). Any ECU that appears to fail as a result of reprogramming errors should not be discarded. We are currently investigating a potential recovery method for these ECUs. More details will be provided as information becomes available. Please advise all technicians to use version 13.0 scantool software until further notice. How to Report Feedback In the event that any anomalies are detected, it is critical that TMS Service Technology Department be notified immediately by completing an Electronic Feedback Report. To use this report, go to the Diagnostics link - Diagnostic Tester Software page on TIS and click on the "Feedback Report" link. As a reminder, this report can be used at anytime to report software concerns. Also from Dealer Daily: Published on: 11/18/2005 12:00 AM Title: ECU Damage While Reprogramming with V13.1a Scantool Software All dealers must ensure they are using scantool software version 13.0a for SSC 50P and all other functions unless performing non- reprogramming diagnostics on 2006 Prius, 2006 RAV4, or 2006 IS250/350 models. On November 2nd, a Dealer Daily message admonished all dealers to immediately revert to software version 13.0a because version 13.1a was suspected of contributing to an emerging problem with ECUs being damaged during reprogramming. This was evidenced mostly in the SSC 50P campaign on Prius. Further analysis has revealed that the software is at fault and a new version 13.2a is being validated for release in December. To prevent further damage and possible shortage of ECUs it is imperative that dealers not use version 13.1a software. Both versions of software are still available on TIS to ensure non- reprogramming diagnostic support for 2006 Prius, 2006 RAV4, or 2006 IS250/350 models. The table below describes proper use in more detail.
I got my notice just yesterday. I'm tempted to call and ask which version of scantool they have just to see if they are up on their game. If they can tell me which version they use AND if they understand why I'm asking, then I have no problem having them performing the flash. On the other hand, if they can't tell me their version, then I'll wait.
I'm really glad this got posted. However I can see how this could be a major issue if dealership service departments don't read the online communications from Toyota every day and take appropriate action. Sometimes the critical link in field service isn't getting the communications out there, but getting people to read them. I hope that isn't the case for whoever I go to for my update.
Talk about déjà vu, this is so eerie. In the late 80’s to early 90’s I was commissioning Honeywell ST3000 “smart†transmitter heads for various industrial sensors: RTD, ORP, flow, level, etc. They were not a “FieldBus†like the modern ProfiBus or Foundation FieldBus segments but had enhanced communications – like HART does - over the 4-20mA analog twisted pair wiring back to the control room. Naturally, the enhanced communication was only supported by Honeywell Hiway Gateway and process boxes. To setup and configure the ST-3000 heads, Honeywell had a smart communicator, about the size of that tablet that UPS drivers used to use. Around 1991, with a new revision, we suddenly couldn’t change parameters using the smart transmitter. We had to be in the control room, at the US3000 console, in Engineer mode, to effect changes to the ST-3000 heads. Turned out it was a small but critical error in the smart transmitter. Had to ship all of them back to Honeywell, they fixed them and it was fine afterwards. IIRC we never actually fried any field instruments, just couldn’t “talk†to them at the transmitter head. That may sound minor, but I suggest you try to span/zero an ORP using three different control solutions from the control room. Your legs will fall off from all the walking back and forth.
if your going to get it done why not wait for a month or two and see if 13.2a becomes available and get the latest flash instead of one that's at least 2-3 months old. Better yet wait till mid January and if no posts of dealers crashing computers come up I'd consider it then. But as I've said before if you car hasn't stalled yet why do it at all? Only possible reason is to get the latest version and hopefully another mile to the gallon. Or possible loose a mile to the gallon.
Is the ScanTool the flashing tool or the flash itself? With the word "tool" in it's name, I would think that it's the tool used to flash the ECU. Also, it sounds as though it can be used for diagnostics. Here at work, people design and develop hardware. More to this thread, they design and develop the firmware that makes the hardware work. There is a software that we use to put the firmare into the hardware. They can upgrade the loading software without changing the firmware. Sometimes there's a problem with the loading software and firmware doesn't always load correctly. This sounds like the issue here. If I'm right, then using an old loading software to load a current firmware isn't going to affect the firmware. Likewise, waiting to use a new loading software to load the firmware isn't going to improve the firmware. Then again, if I haven't had any problems, then why am I worrying about this? Then again, has it been proven that the 50P directly and negatively affects mileage? Is this hearsay or has it been proven?
Tony the THHT is used to download from Toyota the latest updates to the THHT and then it's connected to the car and the updated software is then loaded onto the car's computer/s. Most manufactures use this same type of system to update their cars.
Frank, While I recognize most of those words as being contemporary English I never in my life anticipated seeing them in quite that combination and order and can't quite make out what they mean.
THHT: Toyota Hand Held Tester THHT connects to Toyota headquarters and down loads the latest software. Tech hooks THHT (with the latest sofware) to your cars computer and uploads the software then your on your way.
Ahhh. And the THHT is the Scan Tool? And that's a physical device? What are the versions: 13.1a, 13.0a, 13.2a?
13.1a Bad 13.0a old+good 13.2 in Beta as we type. this is my understanding at this time. THHT is the hand held tester that the tech hooks to your car to get the codes that set the MIL or to see what is going on with the car by pulling all the data stored in the computers. 14"long 6"wide 3" thick wires plug into the bottom if I recall correctly.
THHT is a hand held computer that reads the DLC3 - Data Link Connector 3 sits over by your right knee and allows connection with the CAN and allows for obtaining Diagnostic Trouble Codes from any of the components of the system and allows for reprogramming of ECUs from the CAN Bus. It rally is a small computer that connect with the LANs and downloads DTC (Diagnostic Trouble Codes) and data on the car and also reprogramming of the ECUs (computers in your car) referred to as Flashing. I want one but I understand the cost is like 20k and my wife will not let me get one. Strange, it is only 80% of the cost of the car? Where is she coming from?
