<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(john1701a @ Sep 27 2007, 08:35 AM) [snapback]518406[/snapback]</div> Huh? We were clearly discussing mileage. And as you've pestered and prodded and trolled the folks on GMI, you already know the sales targets and productions.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tideland Prius @ Sep 27 2007, 12:28 AM) [snapback]518311[/snapback]</div> Yep. Tho I'd like to see the epa ratings from the feds to see if it's real. Thinner seats. Aluminum parts for lightning it up ... yep, they have to do something like that to get such a giant slug into the 20's.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hill @ Sep 27 2007, 12:49 PM) [snapback]518520[/snapback]</div> It is carrying a few hundred pounds of batteries, so the thinner seats and aluminum parts just turn it into a wash. Refresh my memory... what kind of mileage numbers do the 4Runner and Land Cruiser pull down?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hill @ Sep 27 2007, 11:49 AM) [snapback]518520[/snapback]</div> I have driven several Tahoe since the new one came out and it is not that hard to avg over 20 mpg on a highway trip. My highest has been 22.6 mpg. That is without the hybrid. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jonnycat26 @ Sep 27 2007, 11:51 AM) [snapback]518522[/snapback]</div> They are ranked just ahead of the m1 abrams tank. :lol:
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jonnycat26 @ Sep 27 2007, 05:44 AM) [snapback]518412[/snapback]</div> What is sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. You are doing here exactly what you are criticizing John of doing on GMI.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(IsrAmeriPrius @ Sep 27 2007, 01:00 PM) [snapback]518532[/snapback]</div> I suggest reading some of John's posts over on GMI. To me, I just don't see the point in being critical of a vehicle/system which is clearly showing huge gains. And I suppose the other layer to the observation about the 4Runner/Land Cruiser would be, when is Toyota going to do something for their behemoths.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jonnycat26 @ Sep 27 2007, 09:51 AM) [snapback]518522[/snapback]</div> Yeah but every little bit counts, no? Take the 2002 Camry XLE for example (our old car). It weighed 1,500kg. My friend's smaller automatic-equipped TSX weighs more than that! Heck, even the Nitro and Caliber in R/T form weigh as much as the Camry and they're much smaller in size.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jonnycat26 @ Sep 27 2007, 07:47 AM) [snapback]518393[/snapback]</div> It can mean 2-mode hybrid sucks in the city. I would give the highway MPG credit to the displacement on demand which is not a hybrid exclusive tech at all. In 2-mode, the highly taunted 2nd mode (pure mechanical power transmission) on the highway will only have this sweet spot at a specific speed (@70 mph). Go above or under 70mph and it will be electrically powered partly (input split mode 1). In the real world traffic, this 2nd mode will be practically useless.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jonnycat26 @ Sep 27 2007, 12:47 PM) [snapback]518561[/snapback]</div> So do I, rather than just accepting the conclusion drawn for you. You'll find quite a struggle to keep the discussions constructive. They absolutely love attacking anyone with any interest in Toyota, especially if your own one. So no matter how objective your questions & comments are, they figure it is somehow a clever way of promoting the competition. My push there was to learn details about the GM hybrid designs. That's extremely difficult to come by. Going to the source makes sense. So I did. And fortunately, some members ended up helping out.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(usbseawolf2000 @ Sep 27 2007, 02:30 PM) [snapback]518624[/snapback]</div> I've heard comments about a "sweet spot" with the cylinder-deactivation too. So I'm quite curious what the real-world MPG data will be. As for city driving, the newest bit of detail available is that the upper limit for stealth is 32 MPH. That should also make the data interesting.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(john1701a @ Sep 27 2007, 01:21 PM) [snapback]518659[/snapback]</div> Mind posting the links to the relevant threads in question?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(john1701a @ Sep 27 2007, 04:50 PM) [snapback]518674[/snapback]</div> Vehicle curb weight to battery pack ratio also reveals why 2-mode sucks in the city. Prius, TCH and HH have 14 to 15 lbs/volt ratio. Prius: 2,890 lbs / 201.6 V TCH: 3,680 lbs / 244 V HH: 4,070 lbs / 288 V I don't have the weight for Tahoe hybrid but for the Yukon hybrid, it has an anemic (17.6 lbs/volt) battery pack. Yukon Hybrid: 5,270 lbs / 300 V I use volt because each NiMH cell makes nominal 1.2 Volts.
Some more topic for discussion: What emission improvement does 2-mode hybrids bring? Does it achieve SULEV or PZEV? How long will it take until it pays for itself? ;-) What will CNW Marketing ASSume the life time of this 2-mode hybrid? How about the environment affect from it's 300 volt battery pack? ;-) Where is GM's plan to recycle 300 volt NiMH battery pack? Where is the recycling plant? Do they have bounty fee to bring the pack back in (like Toyota). Will the 300 volt battery pack cut the fuse in case of an emergency? Where is GM's document for the emergency rescue to safely avoid the HV battery wire? Since GM is cutting cost by including a smaller HV battery pack (compare to Toyota HSD standard), how long is their warranty? The concern is that smaller pack will need to discharge more power, hence shorter life. 10 year is a long time to catch up.....
