1. Attachments are working again! Check out this thread for more details and to report any other bugs.

Why we need immigrants

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by bwilson4web, May 18, 2024.

  1. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2005
    27,340
    15,495
    0
    Location:
    Huntsville AL
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    Source: Alabama poultry plant could be closed for 30 days for allegedly hiring minors | Alabama | The Guardian

    Mar-Jac Poultry, the largest employer in Walker county, is accused of violating federal labor laws when it hired four minors as young as 16 who were allegedly discovered working overnight at the company’s slaughterhouse.

    Mar-Jac is the same firm that was found to be directly responsible for the death of a 16-year-old at a plant in neighboring Mississippi last summer. In May 2021, a Mar-Jac employee was killed when he was pinned “partially under” a machine after it snagged his sleeve.

    We need labor for low paying, dangerous jobs. Of course, native born are free to send their kids, grandkids, and teenagers to Mar-Jac Poulty. They have openings.

    Bob Wilson
     
    bisco likes this.
  2. soft_r

    soft_r Junior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2024
    56
    28
    2
    Location:
    Beverly Hills
    Vehicle:
    2024 Prius
    Model:
    LE
    Too bad we don't have any of those homeless types to round up and give a job to. We're just too prosperous of a nation and have no unemployment so companies have to resort to importing cheap labor.

    Let the companies that can't afford employees fail. Let the social security net ponzi scheme crumble. Let population decline a bit. None of these things are the end of the world but somehow these and other bs excuses are used to justify the importation of uneducated unskilled laborers who will work for cheap. This is just one of many excuses to keep importing cheap labor that undercuts the poverty class in America. In the end it's about keeping that pesky GDP number going up while suppressing wages. To call it anything but exploitation is to lie or be ignorant.
     
  3. douglasjre

    douglasjre Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2008
    1,843
    645
    0
    Location:
    Orlando, FL
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    ----USA----
    Women are out equals. How many women work there? If less than 50%, then force women to be our equals with hiring quotas
     
  4. PriusCamper

    PriusCamper Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2012
    11,034
    4,489
    0
    Location:
    Pacific Northwest, USA
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    Wow... So many crucial misspellings in this thread...
     
    #4 PriusCamper, May 19, 2024
    Last edited: May 19, 2024
  5. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    108,501
    49,308
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    there's quite a history of immigrants doing the jobs that americans don't want. the only difference today is the immigration political football.
    i don't think 'letting everything fall apart' is the answer, many of these jobs are critical to our economy, safety, international economic competitiveness, living standard and etc.
    if it's just a euphemism for xenophobia, then i understand perfectly.
     
    Danno5060 and Zythryn like this.
  6. PriusCamper

    PriusCamper Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2012
    11,034
    4,489
    0
    Location:
    Pacific Northwest, USA
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    Immigration has always been as you say a "political football" because if you can get people angry enough to start fighting each other they're less likely to notice that they should be fighting the politicians who are creating the diversion/distraction to get people fighting each other.

    For example after World War two the remaining 3 million of formerly 9 million European Jews wanted to get out of Europe and there was intense opposition to Jewish immigration to the US both during and after WWII. Most of the problems in Palestine today wouldn't exist had the US let European Jews immigrate to the US. It also would of meant that a small indigenous population of less than 10% in every mid-east country prior to WWII wouldn't of been wiped out as retaliation for what the Nation of Israel did to Palestine...

    As in sometimes xenophobia can become akin to an infectious disease.
     
    fuzzy1 likes this.
  7. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2005
    27,340
    15,495
    0
    Location:
    Huntsville AL
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    My first letter from my Congressman had two paragraphs about 'the emigrant invasion.' So I sent a follow up letter with these paragraphs:
    • Russians and Hamas emigrated across the borders with automatic weapons, grenades, anti-tank rockets, and murderous and rape intentions. When the Hispanics cross our border with machine guns, grenades, anti-tank rockets, uniforms, mass rape, and murder, I'll change my mind.
    • The low wage, hard, dangerous jobs that Hispanic emigrants take that are so valuable for our farmers, roofers, tree trimers, and other jobs even our teenagers won't take.
    His most recent letter did not mention Hispanic emigrations but instead laid on his family planning and library policies. I won't be replying as my job is done.

    Bob Wilson
     
  8. soft_r

    soft_r Junior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2024
    56
    28
    2
    Location:
    Beverly Hills
    Vehicle:
    2024 Prius
    Model:
    LE
    They do the jobs americans don't want to do FOR POVERTY WAGES. That last part is important. That's what you're really saying. You want them here not because they're hard workers or because they uplift communities or because you want them to have a better life. Your sole argument is that you want them here because they are easily exploitable and will work for scraps.

    You're like one or two steps removed from advocating for outright slavery.

    Did you notice how when the border influx stopped during and just after covid that suddenly a bunch of places were increasing their wages because they couldn't find workers to do it for shit pay anymore? Weird how that coincided. Wonder if that means something.

    Even Carl Marx noticed this in his day:
    And most important of all! Every industrial and commercial centre in England now possesses a working class divided into two hostile camps, English proletarians and Irish proletarians. The ordinary English worker hates the Irish worker as a competitor who lowers his standard of life. In relation to the Irish worker he regards himself as a member of the ruling nation and consequently he becomes a tool of the English aristocrats and capitalists against Ireland, thus strengthening their domination over himself. He cherishes religious, social, and national prejudices against the Irish worker. His attitude towards him is much the same as that of the “poor whites” to the Negroes in the former slave states of the U.S.A. The Irishman pays him back with interest in his own money. He sees in the English worker both the accomplice and the stupid tool of the English rulers in Ireland.

    This antagonism is artificially kept alive and intensified by the press, the pulpit, the comic papers, in short, by all the means at the disposal of the ruling classes. This antagonism is the secret of the impotence of the English working class, despite its organization. It is the secret by which the capitalist class maintains its power. And the latter is quite aware of this.
     
  9. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2005
    27,340
    15,495
    0
    Location:
    Huntsville AL
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    It is the price of admission to citizenship. With rare exception, our first family members in this country paid that price so their kids and eventually the gentle readers could become citizens.

    Personally, like farm automation, I look forward to automated, AI workers:
    upload_2024-5-19_14-5-40.png
    It will challenge the native born to master skills they can't imagine. As for emigrants, they will still be needed to train the robots.

    Bob Wilson
     
    #9 bwilson4web, May 19, 2024
    Last edited: May 19, 2024
  10. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    108,501
    49,308
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    i doubt any americans will work in a meat packing plant no matter the wage. also, we have a population problem. there aren't enough of us to fill the lowest jobs, whatever they may be.
     
    Zythryn likes this.
  11. PriusCamper

    PriusCamper Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2012
    11,034
    4,489
    0
    Location:
    Pacific Northwest, USA
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    In other words we have an immigration disinformation problem created by right wing politicians to mobilize their base to get votes. As in the harder they make it for immigrants to get into the country, the harder it is for businesses to find people to hire.
     
    Mendel Leisk and Zythryn like this.
  12. Rmay635703

    Rmay635703 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2016
    2,590
    1,608
    0
    Location:
    Somewhere in Wisconsin
    Vehicle:
    2013 Chevy Volt
    Model:
    N/A
    Half of the homeless are employed and half of male homeless are veterans.

    our “workforce participation “ rates have been dropping for years but at the same time have more people working numerically than in the past.

    There are but not in the right age range, oddly more of the very elderly are re-entering the workforce in the lower level jobs relating to food, grocery and anscillary teaching and assistant roles even childcare.

    whole new world, our first engineer worked into his 90’s
     
  13. douglasjre

    douglasjre Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2008
    1,843
    645
    0
    Location:
    Orlando, FL
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    ----USA----
    Mexico sells us drugs only because we are dumb enough to buy drugs. So what's worse, the country that sells drugs or the country that buys them
     
  14. PriusCamper

    PriusCamper Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2012
    11,034
    4,489
    0
    Location:
    Pacific Northwest, USA
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    I think you need to look into who's selling guns to central and South America these days... It ain't the US government anymore, it's US gun stores selling to organized crime because every time there's another school shooting the gun rights advocates in the US boost their profits at home and abroad. The profits are ten fold when it comes to buying guns, especially assault rifles, and selling them south of the border.
     
  15. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2005
    27,340
    15,495
    0
    Location:
    Huntsville AL
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    I asked Mr Google for fentanyl arrests in Madison County AL:

    Feb 13, 2024
    55-year-old Shawn Douglas Blackman was arrested and charged with Trafficking Fentanyl and Trafficking Methamphetamine.​

    Dec. 25, 2023
    Kelvis Steven Hernandez Maldonado, 24, and Anthony Javier Hernandez Maldonado, 21, were arrested on drug trafficking charges​

    Aug 22, 2022
    they arrested 32-year-old Juan Orlando Matthews Jr., 35-year-old Lawrence O’Neal Beasley and 34-year-old Willie Earl Grace Jr. for drug trafficking​

    Apr 28, 2022
    a large amount of fentanyl . . . Vander Mingledolph, 36, was charged with two counts of drug trafficking and one count of possession of marijuana.​

    Mar 8, 2017
    arrested include Bobby Lamb, 28, of Gadsden, and Madison County residents Cortez Whiteside, 28, and Salayeth McCraney, 31.​

    Where are the Hispanics bringing in fentanyl?

    Bob Wilson
     
    #15 bwilson4web, May 20, 2024
    Last edited: May 20, 2024
  16. soft_r

    soft_r Junior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2024
    56
    28
    2
    Location:
    Beverly Hills
    Vehicle:
    2024 Prius
    Model:
    LE
    There are men crawling into sewers in major cities and clearing out literal feces. There are plenty of processing plants with adult americans working in them just fine. This is a dumb argument. We do not need to import exploitable laborers. There are no jobs americans won't do. We do them all.
     
  17. douglasjre

    douglasjre Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2008
    1,843
    645
    0
    Location:
    Orlando, FL
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    ----USA----
    In Mexico. You don't understand trafficking. Search words: el paso, McAllen, Brownsville, Baja, drug trafficking, underground, China, manufacturing, GDP I don't have the time to teach you this topic
     
  18. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2009
    17,239
    10,130
    90
    Location:
    Western Washington
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    My first generation immigrant ancestors that I've heard about (admittedly, only a small sample of them) did work hard, but received better than poverty wages or built their own businesses, so were able to build a good life for themselves reasonably quickly, not delayed to later generations.

    None arrived with advance reservations. They simply showed up at the docks, where the later ones also had to sign in, but with little risk of rejection.

    The legal market for new civilian assault rifles and other machineguns closed 38 years ago yesterday (May 19, 1986). But many people keep conflating terminology for dramatic effect. For Josh Sugarmann, that conflation was very intentional from the start.

    The last time I checked, illegal and legal recreational drug profits each vastly exceed the civilian arms industry profits. Government arms industry profits are another matter.
     
    #18 fuzzy1, May 21, 2024
    Last edited: May 21, 2024
  19. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2005
    27,340
    15,495
    0
    Location:
    Huntsville AL
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    Prime Plus
  20. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2010
    7,744
    6,537
    0
    Location:
    Redneck Riviera (Gulf South)
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    Trending in a good direction........for P45.